Resentments?

[Kirk S]

Hi all,

I'm trying to understand resentments. I know when I feel them and want to
better understand where they come from. I'm working on a simple model that
describes how they are formed.

I believe healthy relationships are built by doing things WITH people.
Resentments form when doing things FOR people. Doing FOR someone can cause
feelings of obligation. We then start doing things TO them.

FOR and TO are tools of attempting to control others.

What am I missing?

Kirk S.

[Moonraker]

"Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:oUuTb.11546$sd.10808@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Hi all,
>
> I'm trying to understand resentments. I know when I feel them and want to
> better understand where they come from. I'm working on a simple model
that
> describes how they are formed.
>
> I believe healthy relationships are built by doing things WITH people.
> Resentments form when doing things FOR people. Doing FOR someone can
cause
> feelings of obligation. We then start doing things TO them.
>
> FOR and TO are tools of attempting to control others.
>
> What am I missing?
>
> Kirk S.
>
>
Expectations?

Woody Hayes, of Ohio State football fame, used to say that there were only 3
things that could happen when a team throws a football. And 2 of them were
bad. (Complete, incomplete, or intercepted.)

If you think about it, anytime you have a want or expectation, there are
only 3 things that can happen. And 2 of them are bad.

You CAN get what you want or expect.
You can NOT get what you want or expect.
Or, you DO get what you do not want.

Placing expectations on people is nothing more than a premeditated
resentment.

[JB]

"Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:oUuTb.11546$sd.10808@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Hi all,
>
> I'm trying to understand resentments. I know when I feel them and
want to
> better understand where they come from. I'm working on a simple
model that
> describes how they are formed.
>
> I believe healthy relationships are built by doing things WITH
people.
> Resentments form when doing things FOR people. Doing FOR someone
can cause
> feelings of obligation. We then start doing things TO them.
>
> FOR and TO are tools of attempting to control others.
>
> What am I missing?
>
> Kirk S.

Hi Kirk,

As part of what I'm doing to help myself recover I listen to AA
tapes spoken by two, well-respected American non-drinking alcoholics
called Joe and Charlie.

If I've understood their view of resentments correctly it's this::

It starts with someone doing something that upsets you. What they did
becomes a resentment when you replay in your head whatever it was they
did and allow it to upset you all over again. Each time you replay
the event, it's a resentment. If with each replay you downplay just
a little more any part you had in causing the original event to
happen, you'll end up feeling "pure as the driven snow " ( a Joe and
Charlie quote) and also that what ever caused you to initially get
upset
was due to the fact that the "mean old world" (another Joe and Charlie
quote) is always out to get ya.

(smiling)

Two of the many wonderful memories I have of these tapes is Charlie
saying something like: "when an alcoholic gets up in the morning he
wraps around him the cloak of self pity and says "come on world
come and git me" and "a bad day for an alcoholic is when no-one does
anything to them to upset them On days like that, the alcoholic holds
resentments against others for what they might be "thinking". LOL.

HTH

JB

[Kirk S]

"Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
news:0bvTb.9140$_r.2593@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
>
> "Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:oUuTb.11546$sd.10808@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I'm trying to understand resentments. I know when I feel them and want
to
> > better understand where they come from. I'm working on a simple model
> that
> > describes how they are formed.
> >
> > I believe healthy relationships are built by doing things WITH people.
> > Resentments form when doing things FOR people. Doing FOR someone can
> cause
> > feelings of obligation. We then start doing things TO them.
> >
> > FOR and TO are tools of attempting to control others.
> >
> > What am I missing?
> >
> > Kirk S.
> >
> >
> Expectations?

Exactly! Applying my lens on the world to other people and expecting them
to adhere to my standards.

Guilty as charged! Then feeling justified in being angry at them for not
living up to my expectations.

Geez, what a racket!

Kirk S.
>
> Woody Hayes, of Ohio State football fame, used to say that there were only
3
> things that could happen when a team throws a football. And 2 of them
were
> bad. (Complete, incomplete, or intercepted.)
>
> If you think about it, anytime you have a want or expectation, there are
> only 3 things that can happen. And 2 of them are bad.
>
> You CAN get what you want or expect.
> You can NOT get what you want or expect.
> Or, you DO get what you do not want.
>
> Placing expectations on people is nothing more than a premeditated
> resentment.
>
>
>
>

[JB]

"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bvm0ad$v8b$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:oUuTb.11546$sd.10808@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I'm trying to understand resentments. I know when I feel them and
> want to
> > better understand where they come from. I'm working on a simple
> model that
> > describes how they are formed.
> >
> > I believe healthy relationships are built by doing things WITH
> people.
> > Resentments form when doing things FOR people. Doing FOR someone
> can cause
> > feelings of obligation. We then start doing things TO them.
> >
> > FOR and TO are tools of attempting to control others.
> >
> > What am I missing?
> >
> > Kirk S.
>
> Hi Kirk,
>
> As part of what I'm doing to help myself recover I listen to AA
> tapes spoken by two, well-respected American non-drinking alcoholics
> called Joe and Charlie.
>
> If I've understood their view of resentments correctly it's this::
>
> It starts with someone doing something that upsets you. What they
did
> becomes a resentment when you replay in your head whatever it was
they
> did and allow it to upset you all over again. Each time you replay
> the event, it's a resentment.

<snip>

PS:

In simple terms:

Re = return to

Resentment = return to the source of the anger, bitterness, ill-will

[Kirk S]

"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bvm1u3$83o$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...
> "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> news:bvm0ad$v8b$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > "Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
> > news:oUuTb.11546$sd.10808@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > I'm trying to understand resentments. I know when I feel them and
> > want to
> > > better understand where they come from. I'm working on a simple
> > model that
> > > describes how they are formed.
> > >
> > > I believe healthy relationships are built by doing things WITH
> > people.
> > > Resentments form when doing things FOR people. Doing FOR someone
> > can cause
> > > feelings of obligation. We then start doing things TO them.
> > >
> > > FOR and TO are tools of attempting to control others.
> > >
> > > What am I missing?
> > >
> > > Kirk S.
> >
> > Hi Kirk,
> >
> > As part of what I'm doing to help myself recover I listen to AA
> > tapes spoken by two, well-respected American non-drinking alcoholics
> > called Joe and Charlie.
> >
> > If I've understood their view of resentments correctly it's this::
> >
> > It starts with someone doing something that upsets you. What they
> did
> > becomes a resentment when you replay in your head whatever it was
> they
> > did and allow it to upset you all over again. Each time you replay
> > the event, it's a resentment.
>
> <snip>
>
> PS:
>
> In simple terms:
>
> Re = return to
>
> Resentment = return to the source of the anger, bitterness, ill-will

Yup... Hanging onto them is just as dangerous as putting a beer in my hand.
Name it, Claim it, Dump it....

Why do we choose to hang onto them when they are so dangerous?

Kirk S.
>
>
>

[Moonraker]

"Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:zXvTb.11648$sd.8523@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Yup... Hanging onto them is just as dangerous as putting a beer in my
hand.
> Name it, Claim it, Dump it....
>
> Why do we choose to hang onto them when they are so dangerous?
>
> Kirk S.
> >
Because, by damn, they are OUR resentments. We nutured them, fed them, and
we fucking well enjoy dragging that Radio Flyer wagon full of them around
behind us. In some cases a good resentment is the only thing we have to
keep our hollow selves from imploding.

[Kirk S]

"Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
news:52wTb.13971$tl5.6211@bignews1.bellsouth.net.. .
>
> "Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:zXvTb.11648$sd.8523@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > Yup... Hanging onto them is just as dangerous as putting a beer in my
> hand.
> > Name it, Claim it, Dump it....
> >
> > Why do we choose to hang onto them when they are so dangerous?
> >
> > Kirk S.
> > >
> Because, by damn, they are OUR resentments. We nutured them, fed them,
and
> we fucking well enjoy dragging that Radio Flyer wagon full of them around
> behind us. In some cases a good resentment is the only thing we have to
> keep our hollow selves from imploding.
>
Because we can use them as an excuse for our next drink? To me, it isn't a
relapse; cancer patients relapse, alcoholics chose to drink.

Kirk S.
>

[Moonraker]

"Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:YjwTb.11757$sd.319@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> "Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
> news:52wTb.13971$tl5.6211@bignews1.bellsouth.net.. .
> >
> > "Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
> > news:zXvTb.11648$sd.8523@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > > Yup... Hanging onto them is just as dangerous as putting a beer in my
> > hand.
> > > Name it, Claim it, Dump it....
> > >
> > > Why do we choose to hang onto them when they are so dangerous?
> > >
> > > Kirk S.
> > > >
> > Because, by damn, they are OUR resentments. We nutured them, fed them,
> and
> > we fucking well enjoy dragging that Radio Flyer wagon full of them
around
> > behind us. In some cases a good resentment is the only thing we have to
> > keep our hollow selves from imploding.
> >
> Because we can use them as an excuse for our next drink? To me, it isn't
a
> relapse; cancer patients relapse, alcoholics chose to drink.
>
> Kirk S.
> >

Yeah, that too.

[The Other Harry]

[On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 16:28:04 GMT, "Kirk S"
<kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote:]

> I'm trying to understand resentments. I know when I feel
> them and want to better understand where they come from.

This may not be responsive, but I'll give it a try.

There is a phenomenom called "alcoholic rage". It is not
well understood, but you can readily see the vestages of
it in the posts to this newsgroup. There's no need for a
magnifying glass.

In some of us, it shows up when we are drunk. In others,
it shows up when we are sober.

My own take is that is something to do with our own
frustrations with ourselves. For some of us, the booze
lets it out. For others, the booze subdues it.

I do both.

You need to be careful about it. I once picked my GF's
computer up and threw it against a wall. I can't recall
whether I was drunk or sober at the time, but doing that
cost me about $1000.

Not good.

It was based on a resentment that had been simmering for
several months. She had moved in with me and was
basically living off me. I was pissed. I had expected
her to get a job, but she hadn't done that.

I had not said anything, then one day I exploded.

Booze was in the equation there, somewhere. I could have
just talked to her.

--
Harry

[rosie]

on pages:
15, 18, 64, 66, 68, 70, 79, 84, 86, 100, 105, 116, 117, 119, 122,
126, 127, 145 of the BIG BOOK OF AA, you will find some answers!

--
read and post daily, it works!
rosie

It is an unfortunate human failing that a full pocketbook often
groans
more loudly than an empty stomach.
...............................Franklin Delano Roosevelt

http://www.coxar.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/










"Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:oUuTb.11546$sd.10808@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Hi all,
>
> I'm trying to understand resentments. I know when I feel them and
want to
> better understand where they come from. I'm working on a simple
model that
> describes how they are formed.
>
> I believe healthy relationships are built by doing things WITH
people.
> Resentments form when doing things FOR people. Doing FOR someone
can cause
> feelings of obligation. We then start doing things TO them.
>
> FOR and TO are tools of attempting to control others.
>
> What am I missing?
>
> Kirk S.
>
>

[rosie]

> Yup... Hanging onto them is just as dangerous as putting a beer
in my hand.
> Name it, Claim it, Dump it....
>


"on the nose......................"

[Bobby L.]

"Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:oUuTb.11546$sd.10808@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Hi all,
>
> I'm trying to understand resentments. I know when I feel them and want to
> better understand where they come from. I'm working on a simple model
that
> describes how they are formed.
>
> I believe healthy relationships are built by doing things WITH people.
> Resentments form when doing things FOR people. Doing FOR someone can
cause
> feelings of obligation. We then start doing things TO them.
>
> FOR and TO are tools of attempting to control others.
>
> What am I missing?
>
> Kirk S.
>
>

The type you describe is one way to get to a resentment.... But you have the
source wrong.... We typically do NOT do thing FOR others. We do things FOR
OURSELVES that appear and we see as FOR others. It not the doing that
leads to the resentment...as others have said... it is the unfulfilled
expectation that leads to the resentment. I can take a little righteous
indignation and carry that a long way for a long time... That's a
resentment, but only one kind.

The goal is not to stop doing FOR others. The goal is to learn how to do
FOR others graciously -- expecting and deserving NOTHING in return.

[Kirk S]

"Bobby L." <BobbyL2000nospam@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:izBTb.10486$_r.9574@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
>
> "Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:oUuTb.11546$sd.10808@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I'm trying to understand resentments. I know when I feel them and want
to
> > better understand where they come from. I'm working on a simple model
> that
> > describes how they are formed.
> >
> > I believe healthy relationships are built by doing things WITH people.
> > Resentments form when doing things FOR people. Doing FOR someone can
> cause
> > feelings of obligation. We then start doing things TO them.
> >
> > FOR and TO are tools of attempting to control others.
> >
> > What am I missing?
> >
> > Kirk S.
> >
> >
>
> The type you describe is one way to get to a resentment.... But you have
the
> source wrong.... We typically do NOT do thing FOR others. We do things
FOR
> OURSELVES that appear and we see as FOR others. It not the doing that
> leads to the resentment...as others have said... it is the unfulfilled
> expectation that leads to the resentment. I can take a little righteous
> indignation and carry that a long way for a long time... That's a
> resentment, but only one kind.
>
> The goal is not to stop doing FOR others. The goal is to learn how to do
> FOR others graciously -- expecting and deserving NOTHING in return.

Yeah, I guess I should define terms a bit better. There is the generous for
and the selfish FOR. I believe the selfish FOR results in things being done
TO us and hence resentments. Actually, I like the revisiting anger
definition for resentment. Puts the entire responsibility where it belongs:
ME...

Thanks for sharing WITH me...

Kirk S.
>
>
>

[Christine]

>>
>Expectations?
>
>Woody Hayes, of Ohio State football fame, used to say that there were only 3
>things that could happen when a team throws a football. And 2 of them were
>bad. (Complete, incomplete, or intercepted.)
>
>If you think about it, anytime you have a want or expectation, there are
>only 3 things that can happen. And 2 of them are bad.
>
>You CAN get what you want or expect.
>You can NOT get what you want or expect.
>Or, you DO get what you do not want.
>
>Placing expectations on people is nothing more than a premeditated
>resentment.
>

This is so right on for me ... incomplete or intercepted passes all over the
place. I am limiting my expectations of others as much as I am able of doing
right now, although I did have a bad experience today right along these lines.
I didn't realize it was a fumble, though, and I ended up recovering the ball
and am now running for the end zone. Hoorah!

[Moonraker]

"Christine" <ctbean3@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040202222956.11601.00001082@mb-m12.aol.com...
> >>
> >Expectations?
> >
> >Woody Hayes, of Ohio State football fame, used to say that there were
only 3
> >things that could happen when a team throws a football. And 2 of them
were
> >bad. (Complete, incomplete, or intercepted.)
> >
> >If you think about it, anytime you have a want or expectation, there are
> >only 3 things that can happen. And 2 of them are bad.
> >
> >You CAN get what you want or expect.
> >You can NOT get what you want or expect.
> >Or, you DO get what you do not want.
> >
> >Placing expectations on people is nothing more than a premeditated
> >resentment.
> >
>
> This is so right on for me ... incomplete or intercepted passes all over
the
> place. I am limiting my expectations of others as much as I am able of
doing
> right now, although I did have a bad experience today right along these
lines.
> I didn't realize it was a fumble, though, and I ended up recovering the
ball
> and am now running for the end zone. Hoorah!

As I thought about this, there's another set of expectations that cause
resentments.

Those placed upon us by others.

You know, the expectations like coming home sober, not smelling of cheap
perfume, getting to work on time, graduating from school, paying bills,
those sorts of things.

Hell, how could those people be so thoughtless as to expect that "we" were
obligated to DO anything? Don't they know who we ARE? :>)

[Blue Moon]

On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 16:28:04 GMT, "Kirk S"
<kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote:

>Hi all,
>
>I'm trying to understand resentments.

How about "dictonary.com"?

However, as far as I'm concerned "Re-sent-ment" - to replay (re-sent)
old perceived hurts over in the mind. Generates more of a victim
mentality each time, thus deviating from truth.

Can also be applied as a pseudonym for "anger", though I can feel
angry at something without resenting it.

--
Blue Moon

[Blue Moon]

On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:05:44 GMT, "Kirk S"
<kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote:

>Because we can use them as an excuse for our next drink? To me, it isn't a
>relapse; cancer patients relapse, alcoholics chose to drink.

I can't say I ever consciously held onto a resentment as an excuse to
drink. I never needed an excuse to drink, I needed good reasons not
to! But holding onto resentments could very easily have killed me,
whilst sober and with no booze in sight.

My penultimate drink was not a conscious choice. I relapsed, in the
true sense of the word. My last drink was a conscious choice, as a
convincer for Step 1.

--
Blue Moon

[rosie]

> On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:05:44 GMT, "Kirk S"
> <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote:
>
> >Because we can use them as an excuse for our next drink? To me,
it isn't a
> >relapse; cancer patients relapse, alcoholics chose to drink.



relapse? slip? imo, doesn't matter mush to me , except to know
that RELAPSING is a process, NOT an accident.
it does not start with that first drink, but long
before............................
i know that some will find this opinion to "therapy/shemarapy" but
here is a good start:

http://psychcentral.com/library/id77.html

here's to another day!
rosie

[Moonraker]

" rosie" <readandpostNOT@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:2jNTb.14963$2h.4920@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> here's to another day!
> rosie
>
You are offering a TOAST on an alcoholism forum? Dizzy bitch.

[Kirk S]

"Blue Moon" <mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c2ff03aea57f88857af60d57699efb5c@news.teranew s.com...
> On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 16:28:04 GMT, "Kirk S"
> <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote:
>
> >Hi all,
> >
> >I'm trying to understand resentments.
>
> How about "dictonary.com"?
>
> However, as far as I'm concerned "Re-sent-ment" - to replay (re-sent)
> old perceived hurts over in the mind. Generates more of a victim
> mentality each time, thus deviating from truth.

Ah ha!

Perpetuating the victim mentality and giving me something to hold onto for
justification of my anger. That old helpless feeling that things are out of
my control; I become afraid and then I become ANGRY!

Ok, makes sense in my view of things now. In my own experience, most times
that I felt like a victim, I had something to do with it and in those times
where I didn't, I use it to justify how I feel. It goes back to the
expectations not being fulfilled or my attempts to control something outside
of me failed and now I'm pissed.

Just how many rackets do I use in my dealings with the world? Seems like a
lot at this point. I guess I'll learn new ones when I'm ready to give up
the illusion of control offered by the old ones.

Yikes... Sometimes revelations are too revealing!

Kirk S.

P.S. Yeah, my spelling sucks... disliked english, liked science, math,
computers...

>
> Can also be applied as a pseudonym for "anger", though I can feel
> angry at something without resenting it.
>
> --
> Blue Moon

[Kirk S]

"Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
news:SnOTb.74$UF1.36@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
>
> " rosie" <readandpostNOT@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:2jNTb.14963$2h.4920@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > here's to another day!
> > rosie
> >
> You are offering a TOAST on an alcoholism forum? Dizzy bitch.
>

Hey... Sarcasm is just anger's ugly cousin...

Besides, who said a toast had to have alcohol in it? I toast each new
morning with a cup of coffee. Welcoming each new day because I will never
see another one exactly like it again. And I don't have a hangover from
drinking to muddy things up.

Kirk S.
>

[rosie]

>
> Hey... Sarcasm is just anger's ugly cousin...
>
> Besides, who said a toast had to have alcohol in it? I toast each
new
> morning with a cup of coffee. Welcoming each new day because I
will never
> see another one exactly like it again. > Kirk S.
> >
>
>

.........................as do i!
thanking HP for another day of life!

ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....................L'chei-im, le'chayim! - To
life!

[Moonraker]

"Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:gWPTb.16280$2h.10722@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> "Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
> news:SnOTb.74$UF1.36@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
> >
> > " rosie" <readandpostNOT@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:2jNTb.14963$2h.4920@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > > here's to another day!
> > > rosie
> > >
> > You are offering a TOAST on an alcoholism forum? Dizzy bitch.
> >
>
> Hey... Sarcasm is just anger's ugly cousin...
>


Kirk, given that Rosie is dealing with a double digit IQ, I doubt seriously
that she has anywhere near enough "smarts" to be sarcastic about anything.
She was just displaying her thought processes. Or more accurately, lack of
thought.

She's blindly advocated antidepressants to strangers, encouraged still-wet
drunks to drink "virgin" margaritas, confessed to drinking "alcohol-free"
wine, accused folks of not being sober, complained about being harassed,
brags incessantly about her material wealth, and her alleged professional
expertise in medicine and recovery, and the length of her sobriety.

So encouraging a "toast" comes as no surprise. She continues to romance
drugs and alcohol.

If you pay any attention to her other than recognizing her for the sick-ass
troll she is, you'll be drunk again.

[Kirk S]

"Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
news:qLQTb.201$8a5.107@bignews1.bellsouth.net...
>
> "Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:gWPTb.16280$2h.10722@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > "Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
> > news:SnOTb.74$UF1.36@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
> > >
> > > " rosie" <readandpostNOT@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > > news:2jNTb.14963$2h.4920@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > > > here's to another day!
> > > > rosie
> > > >
> > > You are offering a TOAST on an alcoholism forum? Dizzy bitch.
> > >
> >
> > Hey... Sarcasm is just anger's ugly cousin...
> >
>
>
> Kirk, given that Rosie is dealing with a double digit IQ, I doubt
seriously
> that she has anywhere near enough "smarts" to be sarcastic about anything.
> She was just displaying her thought processes. Or more accurately, lack
of
> thought.
>
> She's blindly advocated antidepressants to strangers, encouraged
still-wet
> drunks to drink "virgin" margaritas, confessed to drinking "alcohol-free"
> wine, accused folks of not being sober, complained about being harassed,
> brags incessantly about her material wealth, and her alleged professional
> expertise in medicine and recovery, and the length of her sobriety.
>
> So encouraging a "toast" comes as no surprise. She continues to romance
> drugs and alcohol.
>
> If you pay any attention to her other than recognizing her for the
sick-ass
> troll she is, you'll be drunk again.

Hmmm... Everyone has a right to their opinions and that is one way to look
at it. I would never take advice about medications from anyone other than
my doctor, pharmacist and by doing my own research. I find her insights
interesting and I will take what I want and leave the rest. I don't really
believe people are going to start taking medications from what they read
from a total stranger on a newsgroup. It is also not my place to judge
where anyone else is in their own recovery process.

I also feel that at times it is important to remember why I drank and smoked
weed. I liked the way it made me feel. What I don't like is my choices
around it and reasons for abuse. By embracing my weaknesses, I learn and
become stronger. I accept that there are many people that can enjoy the
effects of alcohol without it being a problem. Strike two is enough to
convince me that I am not one of those people that will ever choose to be
responsible if I drink.

At this point in time, I am careful who I am around and what I put in my
body. I have enough things to deal with that it would be very easy to
simply *forget* all about them by drinking. However, I am going to get a
new job and reconcile the end of my marriage, so falling back into an
addiction isn't going to help at all. It was a choice that I made to *deal*
with the problems and it wasn't the best choice I've made.

I have more than enough on my plate to deal with than to concern myself with
what anyone else is doing or how I can convince them to change. I believe
in myself and my recovery and that is all that matters.

Kirk S.
>
>

[The Other Harry]

[On Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:24:19 -0600, "Kirk S"
<kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote:]

> Welcoming each new day because I will never
> see another one exactly like it again.

I like that. Mind if I borrow it?

It reminds me of something my shrink and I have discussed
at some length. For me, getting out of the house is
important. To put that in the context of your comment, it
helps me greatly to go out and "see the day". Walk the
dog, look at the birds, interact with people, anything.

If I stay inside the house, I'm at risk of starting to
think that maybe it might be nice to have a drink.

In this regard, our computers and TV's may not be our best
friends.

--
Harry

[Moonraker]

"Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:vaRTb.25655$M81.19551@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> I have more than enough on my plate to deal with than to concern myself
with
> what anyone else is doing or how I can convince them to change. I believe
> in myself and my recovery and that is all that matters.
>
> Kirk S.
> >
> >



You seem bright and insightful. The journey you are starting isn't easy,
but well worth the effort.

And I wish you God-speed.

[Robert McGregor]

"Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
news:qLQTb.201$8a5.107@bignews1.bellsouth.net...

>
> If you pay any attention to her other than recognizing her for the
sick-ass
> troll she is, you'll be drunk again.
>
>

Really?

And the consequences of paying attention to your (or my) advice will
*never* be that someone gets drunk again?

Bob

[Moonraker]

"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bvort6$u2ts3$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
> news:qLQTb.201$8a5.107@bignews1.bellsouth.net...
>
> >
> > If you pay any attention to her other than recognizing her for the
> sick-ass
> > troll she is, you'll be drunk again.
> >
> >
>
> Really?
>
> And the consequences of paying attention to your (or my) advice will
> *never* be that someone gets drunk again?
>
> Bob
>

Well....maybe not "never"....would you agree on "highly unlikely"?

[Robert McGregor]

"Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
news:uCSTb.338$uS3.289@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
>
> "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:bvort6$u2ts3$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >
> > "Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
> > news:qLQTb.201$8a5.107@bignews1.bellsouth.net...
> >
> > >
> > > If you pay any attention to her other than recognizing her for
the
> > sick-ass
> > > troll she is, you'll be drunk again.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Really?
> >
> > And the consequences of paying attention to your (or my) advice
will
> > *never* be that someone gets drunk again?
> >
> > Bob
> >
>
> Well....maybe not "never"....would you agree on "highly unlikely"?
>

I would rather avoid a needless gamble, and not give advice.

Ps. That others may choose to interpret my posting of options as
advice (it often happens here) is not my problem.

Bob

[rosie]

"Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:vaRTb.25655$M81.19551@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> "Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
> news:qLQTb.201$8a5.107@bignews1.bellsouth.net...
> >
> > "Kirk S" <kspradling@nospamkc.rr.com> wrote in message
> > news:gWPTb.16280$2h.10722@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > > "Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
> > > news:SnOTb.74$UF1.36@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
> > > >
> > > > " rosie" <readandpostNOT@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > > > news:2jNTb.14963$2h.4920@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> > > > > here's to another day!
> > > > > rosie
> > > > >
> > > > You are offering a TOAST on an alcoholism forum? Dizzy
bitch.
> > > >
> > >
> > > Hey... Sarcasm is just anger's ugly cousin...
> > >
> >
> >
> > Kirk, given that Rosie is dealing with a double digit IQ, I
doubt
> seriously
> > that she has anywhere near enough "smarts" to be sarcastic about
anything.



ROTFLMAO!
MOONIE!
Kirks original sarcasm comment was directed to you!
let not talk about IQ levels, shall we?
LOL!










> > She was just displaying her thought processes. Or more
accurately, lack
> of
> > thought.
> >
> > She's blindly advocated antidepressants to strangers,
encouraged
> still-wet
> > drunks to drink "virgin" margaritas, confessed to drinking
"alcohol-free"
> > wine, accused folks of not being sober, complained about being
harassed,
> > brags incessantly about her material wealth, and her alleged
professional
> > expertise in medicine and recovery, and the length of her
sobriety.
> >
> > So encouraging a "toast" comes as no surprise. She continues
to romance
> > drugs and alcohol.
> >
> > If you pay any attention to her other than recognizing her for
the
> sick-ass
> > troll she is, you'll be drunk again.
>
> Hmmm... Everyone has a right to their opinions and that is one
way to look
> at it. I would never take advice about medications from anyone
other than
> my doctor, pharmacist and by doing my own research. I find her
insights
> interesting and I will take what I want and leave the rest. I
don't really
> believe people are going to start taking medications from what
they read
> from a total stranger on a newsgroup. It is also not my place to
judge
> where anyone else is in their own recovery process.
>
> I also feel that at times it is important to remember why I drank
and smoked
> weed. I liked the way it made me feel. What I don't like is my
choices
> around it and reasons for abuse. By embracing my weaknesses, I
learn and
> become stronger. I accept that there are many people that can
enjoy the
> effects of alcohol without it being a problem. Strike two is
enough to
> convince me that I am not one of those people that will ever
choose to be
> responsible if I drink.
>
> At this point in time, I am careful who I am around and what I put
in my
> body. I have enough things to deal with that it would be very
easy to
> simply *forget* all about them by drinking. However, I am going
to get a
> new job and reconcile the end of my marriage, so falling back into
an
> addiction isn't going to help at all. It was a choice that I made
to *deal*
> with the problems and it wasn't the best choice I've made.
>
> I have more than enough on my plate to deal with than to concern
myself with
> what anyone else is doing or how I can convince them to change. I
believe
> in myself and my recovery and that is all that matters.
>
> Kirk S.
> >
> >
>
>

[rosie]

LOL! is he still at it?
robert, do you see what a madman you've made of MOONIE?
its all your fault!

:)


--
read and post daily, it works!
rosie

Congress has the power to censure the President -- to formally
reprimand him for his betrayal of the nation's trust. If ever there
was a time to use this function, it is now. Join the call for
Congress to censure President Bush now at:
http://www.moveon.org/censure/?id=-1555727-LwxVozqbsXUubaCq5RHn6g



"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bvort6$u2ts3$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Moonraker" <notnow@noway.nev> wrote in message
> news:qLQTb.201$8a5.107@bignews1.bellsouth.net...
>
> >
> > If you pay any attention to her other than recognizing her for
the
> sick-ass
> > troll she is, you'll be drunk again.
> >
> >
>
> Really?
>
> And the consequences of paying attention to your (or my) advice
will
> *never* be that someone gets drunk again?
>
> Bob
>
>
>
>

[Moonraker]

" rosie" <readandpostNOT@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:EGTTb.25663$M81.16561@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>
> let not talk about IQ levels, shall we?
> LOL!
>
>
I wouldn't wanna go there, either, if I were you.

You certainly are no candidate for Mensa.

Menopausal dingbat, maybe.