I need some advice.

[Ryan Atici]

Hi folks...



I am not sure if the definition of "alcoholic" applies to me.



I hate drinking hardcore alcohol. A few years ago, I drank so much "Jack
Daniel", and started throwing up all night long. Ever since that day, even
if I smell any hardcore alcohol, I feel like throwing up.



The only hardcore alcohol I can drink is "Bacardi", but I don't drink that
anymore.



I am a very heavy wine drinker. Just like everybody does, I face hardship in
life. When I drink, I feel better. I feel like I can be myself again. When I
drink wine, I never get nasty, or obnoxious-drunk. When I get my buzz, I
turn into very pleasant and talkative, and friendly person. Before I started
drinking such characteristic virtues used to be my own true nature.



I don't know if I am in denial to think that one can't be an alcoholic just
by drinking wine. Am I wrong to think so?



The reason I am posting this message is because I am behaving in a way that
I don't like. Sometimes I stop and think "it is not me". I have the most
understanding girlfriend. She is nothing but an angel to me. She is so sweet
to me in every way. When I am sober, I am angry. I don't know why I am
angry, but I just don't feel good for some unknown reason. Anything gets me
mad. With every little thing, I lose my temper and start frowning and
yelling at my girlfriend. When I am sober, I am just bitter and hateful
person.



If you ask me how heavy wine drinker I am, I carry a bottle of wine with me
in my car. At work, I get 30 minute break for lunch and 2 15-minute breaks.
Even at 15 minute breaks, I run up to my car and start drinking as much wine
as I can in 15 minutes. Since I drink constantly, even 1.5 litter bottle of
wine is not enough for me to get me through the day. I mean, "every single
day". As soon as I wake up, I drink a class of wine and smoke a cigarette.



From time to time, I tried to quit but it only lasted a day.



Do you think I am an alcoholic? What can I do to stop drinking? When I am
sober, I am a nasty person even towards the ones I dearly love. Don't get me
wrong when I say "nasty"! I am never ever physically abusive, "never". I am
just frowning and getting ticked off with every little thing. I can't go to
a treatment center because of certain reasons. I just want to deal with this
own my own. How can I stop drinking without being nasty when I am sober?
What is the first step to take? I really want to stop drinking. When I am
sober, I also get nervous, and afraid of every little thing. Even driving in
traffic makes me nervous when I am sober. I just need to drink to be
relaxed. I just don't know how to stop drinking. Is "trying to stop
drinking" pretty much like "trying to stop smoking cigarette"? Meaning,
should I reduce drinking slow by slow just like a smoker tries to quit
smoking little by little?



Please, don't be judgmental! Please, don't make fun of me and start
badmouthing me!

[Blue Moon]

On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 21:03:31 -0500, "Ryan Atici"
<Ryan_Atici@hotpop.com> wrote:

>Do you think I am an alcoholic?

Do you? What others think isn't really relevant.

You just described the alcoholic condition pretty well. Alcoholism is
not defined by what one drinks, or how much, or what happens to the
individual whilst drinking. It's defined by what alcohol does *for*
the person.

So yes, it's when we *don't* drink that life can get horrendously
unmanageable. So much so that we have to drink again to stand it.
That is called "alcoholism".

>What can I do to stop drinking?

Stop drinking. If you cannot stop drinking to the point where your
body is physically detoxed from alcohol, you might need to see a
doctor.

Staying stopped is where you might need help elsewhere, which is where
recovery comes in.

>What is the first step to take?

You've basically just admitted you cannot avoid getting drunk, and
that life sucks without it. That's basically the first Step.

I would get along to some AA meetings, discover the remaining 11 Steps
on offer, and take those.

>should I reduce drinking slow by slow just like a smoker tries to quit
>smoking little by little?

The only way I'm aware of to quit drinking is to stop drinking. Don't
know of anyone who managed to cut down successfully. There are
medications to help, such as antabuse or valium. But you've got to
WANT to stop drinking first, and not depend on other substances beyond
physical detox (which could take up to 4 weeks). For the mental stuff
you'll need recovery, not valium. I went along to AA meetings, didn't
like it, but liked how I felt sober even less. So I worked the AA
program, which is 12 Steps, and am now free of much of the social
anxiety etc. which you describe (and which I also had in buckets).

AA should be in your local telephone directory. Available at most AA
meetings, there's a handy little booklet called "Living Sober" which I
found useful in learning how to handle situations The AA program is
written in a book called "Alcoholics Anonymous", also available at any
AA meeting.

Sure there are other options available too, but the AA program worked
for me even though I didn't believe it would.

--
Blue Moon

[Bpyboy]

good response blue!

Yeah, i tried to "moderate" my drinking by only buying about half as much as I
normally drank, with the thought that I would cut it down to perhaps a quarter.


that lasts about 3 days, then I needed to "make up for lost time" and get
completely lit. For me, it's an all or nothing situation. If i'm drinking,
i'm going to get drunk, come hell or high water.

the question "am I an alcoholic" is really just semantics. It doesn't matter
if I officailly AM one, just that I can't stop drinking once I get started with
it. and recognizing that, decided it was time to stop.

still, it sounds to me like running to your car to get a couple hits of wine on
your fifteen minute break isn't a good sign. and I would certainly look into
quitting.

not to preach, but AA offers a support system that helped me terrifically (and
many others here). I have friends who drank plenty more than me who just gave
it up cold turkey.

Whatever works my friend.
John

[The Other Harry]

[On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 21:03:31 -0500, "Ryan Atici"
<Ryan_Atici@hotpop.com> wrote:]

> When I am sober, I am angry. I don't know why I am
> angry, but I just don't feel good for some unknown reason. Anything gets me
> mad. With every little thing, I lose my temper and start frowning and
> yelling at my girlfriend. When I am sober, I am just bitter and hateful
> person.

You just said a mouthful.

I am not going to try to respond -- I am not smart enough --
but it is for this reason that I have started seeing a shrink.

I think much of the anger and rage that we se here relates to
this. It isn't good. I don't consider it to be sobriety.


--
Harry <---- who recently changed his email address

[Blue Moon]

On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 10:24:28 -0500, The Other Harry
<hcdotme@DELETEntelos.net> wrote:

>I think much of the anger and rage that we se here relates to
>this. It isn't good. I don't consider it to be sobriety.

Who is giving out anger and rage? I think you are projecting your own
anger and rage onto the group.

--
Blue Moon

[JB]

"The Other Harry" <hcdotme@DELETEntelos.net> wrote in message
news:ein710pp0pljpdahug4ahiscl3hbjfl0an@4ax.com...
> [On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 21:03:31 -0500, "Ryan Atici"
> <Ryan_Atici@hotpop.com> wrote:]
>
> > When I am sober, I am angry. I don't know why I am
> > angry, but I just don't feel good for some unknown reason.
Anything gets me
> > mad. With every little thing, I lose my temper and start frowning
and
> > yelling at my girlfriend. When I am sober, I am just bitter and
hateful
> > person.
>
> You just said a mouthful.
>
> I am not going to try to respond -- I am not smart enough --
> but it is for this reason that I have started seeing a shrink.
>
> I think much of the anger and rage that we se here relates to
> this. It isn't good. I don't consider it to be sobriety.

> --
> Harry <---- who recently changed his email address

<smiling>

If in order to be judged to have achieved sobriety I have to never
again show anger or rage, then I doubt I'll ever achieve sobriety :^)

JB

[The Other Harry]

[On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:59:06 GMT, Blue Moon
<mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote:]

> Who is giving out anger and rage? I think you are projecting your own
> anger and rage onto the group.

One of us is. Could be me.
--
Harry <---- who recently changed his email address

[Fred Exley]

Wow! I can sure relate to your wine-in-the-car drinking m.o. It's said
alcoholism is 'the lonely disease', and it is, but what's amazing is how
similar all us lonely drinkers really are. I thought I was the only one who
did that, so I tended to stay away from people, not even shopping at any
local stores in the morning for fear I'd run into a neighbor who would smell
the booze on me at such an inappropriate hour. And to 'relax', I'd pack a
bottle of wine in the car, pour a glass into a coffee mug to fool any
passing cop (yeah, right, as if it really would have worked if I were ever
pulled over), and drive around aimlessly. Of course, after an hour or so of
this, I would begin getting impaired, so I'd drive have to concentrate more
and more on driving carefully, and grew more and more paranoid about any
passing cop. Some relaxation.

I too am a friendly, nice guy drunk, and an ass-hole prick when sober. I do
believe that's mainly from the physical effects of the alcohol wearing off,
and secondly my mind beguilingly working me up to an irritable state as a
reason to justify more drinking. The few times I've been sober over 30 days
my mind does seem to mellow somewhat, which leads me to believe if I'm ever
sober a very long time, over a year or so, my personality will adjust to it
appropriately.

As to how to stop, that's the hardest part for me, getting through it. Once
sober a few days I switch gears, and it isn't so bad. I'm Dr. Jekyll and
Mr. Hyde. When sober, I can't remember the drunk me -naturally enough. But
what's strange is the drinking me can't remember who the sober me is either.
We're two strangers. Everybody will tell you you just have to cold-turkey
stop, but the past two times I've found that impossible, and was able to
stop by tapering off over about a three day period. Maybe it just prolonged
the withdrawal, but it worked for me. One thing that REALLY made a
difference: take vitamins, especially B, and try and eat as much as you can.
The alcohol depletes your body of nutrients you really need to think
straight, and I was amazed how I immediately felt somewhat sane again just
after taking a vitamin pill and eating a bit. Good luck! -Fred



"Ryan Atici" <Ryan_Atici@hotpop.com> wrote in message
news:buv89b$m9mvj$1@ID-186312.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Hi folks...
>
>
>
> I am not sure if the definition of "alcoholic" applies to me.
>
>
>
> I hate drinking hardcore alcohol. A few years ago, I drank so much "Jack
> Daniel", and started throwing up all night long. Ever since that day, even
> if I smell any hardcore alcohol, I feel like throwing up.
>
>
>
> The only hardcore alcohol I can drink is "Bacardi", but I don't drink that
> anymore.
>
>
>
> I am a very heavy wine drinker. Just like everybody does, I face hardship
in
> life. When I drink, I feel better. I feel like I can be myself again. When
I
> drink wine, I never get nasty, or obnoxious-drunk. When I get my buzz, I
> turn into very pleasant and talkative, and friendly person. Before I
started
> drinking such characteristic virtues used to be my own true nature.
>
>
>
> I don't know if I am in denial to think that one can't be an alcoholic
just
> by drinking wine. Am I wrong to think so?
>
>
>
> The reason I am posting this message is because I am behaving in a way
that
> I don't like. Sometimes I stop and think "it is not me". I have the most
> understanding girlfriend. She is nothing but an angel to me. She is so
sweet
> to me in every way. When I am sober, I am angry. I don't know why I am
> angry, but I just don't feel good for some unknown reason. Anything gets
me
> mad. With every little thing, I lose my temper and start frowning and
> yelling at my girlfriend. When I am sober, I am just bitter and hateful
> person.
>
>
>
> If you ask me how heavy wine drinker I am, I carry a bottle of wine with
me
> in my car. At work, I get 30 minute break for lunch and 2 15-minute
breaks.
> Even at 15 minute breaks, I run up to my car and start drinking as much
wine
> as I can in 15 minutes. Since I drink constantly, even 1.5 litter bottle
of
> wine is not enough for me to get me through the day. I mean, "every single
> day". As soon as I wake up, I drink a class of wine and smoke a cigarette.
>
>
>
> From time to time, I tried to quit but it only lasted a day.
>
>
>
> Do you think I am an alcoholic? What can I do to stop drinking? When I am
> sober, I am a nasty person even towards the ones I dearly love. Don't get
me
> wrong when I say "nasty"! I am never ever physically abusive, "never". I
am
> just frowning and getting ticked off with every little thing. I can't go
to
> a treatment center because of certain reasons. I just want to deal with
this
> own my own. How can I stop drinking without being nasty when I am sober?
> What is the first step to take? I really want to stop drinking. When I am
> sober, I also get nervous, and afraid of every little thing. Even driving
in
> traffic makes me nervous when I am sober. I just need to drink to be
> relaxed. I just don't know how to stop drinking. Is "trying to stop
> drinking" pretty much like "trying to stop smoking cigarette"? Meaning,
> should I reduce drinking slow by slow just like a smoker tries to quit
> smoking little by little?
>
>
>
> Please, don't be judgmental! Please, don't make fun of me and start
> badmouthing me!
>

[S H]

I have been a drinker for many years..my EX boyfriend (alcohol ruined
the relationship) told me that he doesnt feel I am a total "acoholic"
its just that I don't know when to stop once I start which, i hate to
admit is true! I can tell you from past experiences and what is going on
with me right now, drinking, at some point, will lead to drinking and
driving which happened to me...I got 2 DUI's in 5 days!!!! One on a
Thursday night, and another in a different county on the following
Monday night (both were "aggravated" DUI's, meaning I was WAY over the
""legally drunk" point. I just spent 2 weeks in jail which was hell...I
go to the other county on Feb 2 for my next sentence. NOT only have I
been out LOTS AND LOTS of money (to bail me out of jail was $800 in one
county and $750 in the other) plus both times my car was empounded, plus
attorney's fees arent cheap also because of this, I have lost my license
for a year...not to mention how long for the next sentence...and have to
bum rides to acohol treatment classes which is part of my sentence!!!!!
I also feel that as bad as DUI'S are, this is probably the best thing
that could have come out of it...i didnt kill anyone, or myself and for
that I am thankful! I could be facing a murder sentence(s) plus having
to live with hurting/killing some innocent person or even DEAD! I had a
friend drive me on the rode I was arrested on and it was probably the
most horrible curviest road I've ever been on (i was lost) I SAY
"PLEASE, FOR EVERYONE'S SAKE, IF YOU HAVE A DRINKING OR DRUG PROBLEM,
DONT DRIVE!!! and you might want to think of getting help WHILE YOU
STILL HAVE LICENSE and can drive to get help!

[Julie LaRue]

I have yet to meet someone drives while they are drinking who is able to
consistently make a decision to NOT to drive when they have a head full of
alcohol.
If they keep drinking they will keep driving until they are either locked up
for killing someone while driving, institutionalized, die from alcoholism,
or stop drinking.
You make the choice, its your life.

<I stopped getting drunk driving tickets when I stopped drinking>


"S H" <ESH8@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:3400-40159D17-343@storefull-3351.bay.webtv.net...
> I have been a drinker for many years..my EX boyfriend (alcohol ruined
> the relationship) told me that he doesnt feel I am a total "acoholic"
> its just that I don't know when to stop once I start which, i hate to
> admit is true! I can tell you from past experiences and what is going on
> with me right now, drinking, at some point, will lead to drinking and
> driving which happened to me...I got 2 DUI's in 5 days!!!! One on a
> Thursday night, and another in a different county on the following
> Monday night (both were "aggravated" DUI's, meaning I was WAY over the
> ""legally drunk" point. I just spent 2 weeks in jail which was hell...I
> go to the other county on Feb 2 for my next sentence. NOT only have I
> been out LOTS AND LOTS of money (to bail me out of jail was $800 in one
> county and $750 in the other) plus both times my car was empounded, plus
> attorney's fees arent cheap also because of this, I have lost my license
> for a year...not to mention how long for the next sentence...and have to
> bum rides to acohol treatment classes which is part of my sentence!!!!!
> I also feel that as bad as DUI'S are, this is probably the best thing
> that could have come out of it...i didnt kill anyone, or myself and for
> that I am thankful! I could be facing a murder sentence(s) plus having
> to live with hurting/killing some innocent person or even DEAD! I had a
> friend drive me on the rode I was arrested on and it was probably the
> most horrible curviest road I've ever been on (i was lost) I SAY
> "PLEASE, FOR EVERYONE'S SAKE, IF YOU HAVE A DRINKING OR DRUG PROBLEM,
> DONT DRIVE!!! and you might want to think of getting help WHILE YOU
> STILL HAVE LICENSE and can drive to get help!
>

[neuro equipoise]

On: Sat, Jan 24, 2004, 9:03pm Ryan_Atici@hotpop.com (Ryan*Atici)
wrote:

> When I am sober, I am angry. I don't know
> why I am angry, but I just don't feel good for
> some unknown reason. Anything gets me
> mad. With every little thing, I lose my temper
> and start frowning and yelling at my girlfriend.
> When I am sober, I am just bitter and hateful
> person.

Hello Ryan, I'll answer your question about the anger, by explaining
some things about the brain chemical called dopamine. Dopamine signals
the brain to feel pleasure, and drinking alcohol raises the level of
dopamine in the brain's pleasure centers; that's why you feel happy when
you drink.

Unfortunately, after a while of steady drinking, the brain starts
removing dopamine receptors in order to protect itself, and often
alcohol causes the body to drain its reserves of dopamine. The digestive
system, affected by alcohol, isn't able to absorb nutrients it needs in
order to make brain chemicals, and alcohol replaces meals for many heavy
drinkers.

When the brain starts shutting dopamine receptors, this starts a domino
effect which topples other "feel good" chemicals in the brain, such as
endorphins and "love and nurturing" hormones in the pituitary. Without
those brain chemicals, a person's anger and irritability levels rise,
and a person's tolerance for stress goes way down.

Right now you are in a vicious cycle, because the alcohol is depleting
your reserves faster than the body can rebuild. Things will continue to
decline until you stop the alcohol and start rebuilding your health.
The best part is knowing that it is possible, and that you can get there
as soon as you start. The brain is capable of building new cells
everyday and it needs the proper nutrition and life style choices in
order to help make the withdrawal process easier on you.


Research Quote:

"Dopamine, seems to be concentrated in areas of the brain immediately
adjacent to where the major Endorphin releasing mechanisms lie. When
Dopamine function declines, Endorphin function also declines. Hence,
when too much stress causes failure of Dopamine function, it also causes
loss of your body's natural "pain killer".

Dopamine also runs your body's "Pleasure Center". This is the area of
your brain that allows you to enjoy life. When stress interferes with
your Dopamine function, the Pleasure Center becomes inoperative.
Normally pleasureful activities no longer give any pleasure. With severe
Dopamine/Endorphin malfunction, life becomes painful and devoid of any
pleasure"

http://www.teachhealth.com/chemmess.html