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Moonraker

11-21-2003, 10:37 AM

"The Other Harry" <hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:8n7srv0l926oftplt4r2dbq5oe506kojok@4ax.com...
> [On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:35:46 -0000, "JB"
> <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote:]
>
> > Many of your posts lead to me believe that you
> > think you *ought* to stop drinking but, in truth, you don't *want* to.
>
> That's a very accurate way to put it.
>
> But the "ought to stop" part is not something which I take
> lightly. As has been said to me, I am right about where I
> am going to wind up in a jail, a hospital, or dead.
>
> I have given myself a little time to think about this -- I
> need it because of my previous failures. But I don't give
> myself too long. I need to get some results here.
>
> The criticisms that have been launched at me have mostly
> been fair and on point.

So, when many people who haven't met you personally all come to the same
conclusion and make the same general set of suggestions to you, why are you
so resistant? What's your problem with listening to folks who have been
there, done that?

"NO! Don't change MY diaper. I LIKE sitting in all this shit!" seems to
be your modus operandi.

Frankly, I think we have a better chance of finding Amelia Erhardt alive
and well than you do of getting sober and staying sober.

The Other Harry

11-21-2003, 11:00 AM

[On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:37:36 -0500, "Moonraker"
<fuggadaboutit@bellsouth.net> wrote:]

> So, when many people who haven't met you personally all come to the same
> conclusion and make the same general set of suggestions to you, why are you
> so resistant? What's your problem with listening to folks who have been
> there, done that?
>
> "NO! Don't change MY diaper. I LIKE sitting in all this shit!" seems to
> be your modus operandi.

It's not quite like that. And I have been listening.

The Other Harry

11-21-2003, 11:17 AM

[On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:37:36 -0500, "Moonraker"
<fuggadaboutit@bellsouth.net> wrote:]

> So, when many people who haven't met you personally all come to the same
> conclusion and make the same general set of suggestions to you, why are you
> so resistant? What's your problem with listening to folks who have been
> there, done that?

I'll try this again...

Standard detox and AA do not seem to work for me. They may
work for you. It isn't like I haven't taken a run at it
that way. There are some good ideas there.

But I have some underlying things that are going on. If I
do not get to those -- closer to them, at least -- I think I
am stuck in a loop that has no good outcome.

11-21-2003, 12:03 PM

"Moonraker" <fuggadaboutit@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:j5qvb.21291$ow5.19508@bignews2.bellsouth.net. ..
>
> "The Other Harry" <hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
> news:8n7srv0l926oftplt4r2dbq5oe506kojok@4ax.com...
> > [On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:35:46 -0000, "JB"
> > <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote:]
> >
> > > Many of your posts lead to me believe that you
> > > think you *ought* to stop drinking but, in truth, you don't
*want* to.
> >
> > That's a very accurate way to put it.
> >
> > But the "ought to stop" part is not something which I take
> > lightly. As has been said to me, I am right about where I
> > am going to wind up in a jail, a hospital, or dead.
> >
> > I have given myself a little time to think about this -- I
> > need it because of my previous failures. But I don't give
> > myself too long. I need to get some results here.
> >
> > The criticisms that have been launched at me have mostly
> > been fair and on point.
>
>
> So, when many people who haven't met you personally all come to the
same
> conclusion and make the same general set of suggestions to you, why
are you
> so resistant? What's your problem with listening to folks who have
been
> there, done that?
>
> "NO! Don't change MY diaper. I LIKE sitting in all this shit!"
seems to
> be your modus operandi.
>
> Frankly, I think we have a better chance of finding Amelia Erhardt
alive
> and well than you do of getting sober and staying sober.
>
I don't think Harry's got a hearing problem. I think he might be
scared of giving up what he knows, he can't cope with his withdrawal
symptoms and he's afraid of again failing to kick his habit. FWIW, I
hope that he will soon become so sick and tired of his life as a
drinker that he will acquire the same frame of mind and determination
as was needed by those who have beaten alcoholism and is needed by
those who are now winning their fight against it. I wish him well.

JB

BaldMonkey

11-21-2003, 07:50 PM

An interesting approach - obviously this may be a long term goal

> I have made several failed attempts. I have backed off

Robert McGregor

11-21-2003, 08:17 PM

"BaldMonkey" <BaldMonkey@gigpond> wrote in message
news:3fbeb2e9$0$74766$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.co m...
> An interesting approach - obviously this may be a long term goal
>
> > I have made several failed attempts. I have backed off
>
>
The outcome of similar sentiments expressed here has generally appeared as
an initiation of procrastination.

Bob

BaldMonkey

11-21-2003, 08:26 PM

Bob,

Yes, I procrastinated till I almost died. So far sober for a while on the
second attempt. I think its keep trying and do it now - and do whatever it
takes. Postponing seems a worthless goal and not addressing the issue.

I was a really bad drinker who went on binges till I had to be
hospitalised - but its harder giving up 'normal' smoking. I think the goal
and benefits of a smokingless life are a lot less immediate and evident but
I will have to take the same approach.

Sean

"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bpmd9e$1qfftd$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "BaldMonkey" <BaldMonkey@gigpond> wrote in message
> news:3fbeb2e9$0$74766$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.co m...
> > An interesting approach - obviously this may be a long term goal
> >
> > > I have made several failed attempts. I have backed off
> >
> >
> The outcome of similar sentiments expressed here has generally appeared as
> an initiation of procrastination.
>
> Bob
>
>

Robert McGregor

11-21-2003, 08:47 PM

"BaldMonkey" <BaldMonkey@gigpond> wrote in message
news:3fbebb2a$0$74791$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.co m...
> Bob,
>
> Yes, I procrastinated till I almost died. So far sober for a while on the
> second attempt. I think its keep trying and do it now - and do whatever
it
> takes. Postponing seems a worthless goal and not addressing the issue.
>
> I was a really bad drinker who went on binges till I had to be
> hospitalised - but its harder giving up 'normal' smoking. I think the
goal
> and benefits of a smokingless life are a lot less immediate and evident
but
> I will have to take the same approach.
>
> Sean
>
> "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:bpmd9e$1qfftd$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >
> > "BaldMonkey" <BaldMonkey@gigpond> wrote in message
> > news:3fbeb2e9$0$74766$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.co m...
> > > An interesting approach - obviously this may be a long term goal
> > >
> > > > I have made several failed attempts. I have backed off
> > >
> > >
> > The outcome of similar sentiments expressed here has generally appeared
as
> > an initiation of procrastination.
> >
> > Bob
> >

"BaldMonkey" <BaldMonkey@gigpond> wrote in message
news:3fbebb2a$0$74791$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.co m...

"I think its keep trying and do it now - and do whatever it
takes. "

I believe you summed it up, with elegance!

Good luck with the smokes, I'm leaving that one for my next incarnation.

Bob

KevinB

11-22-2003, 12:05 AM

I'm new to this group and want to share this with you. Just for the
record I go to at least one
if not two A.A. meetings a day and have 8.5 weeks of sobriety, which
amazes not only me but
my wife kids......

I have a close A.A. friend we'll call him Mark, cause that's his name.
Before coming to A.A.
he had been sober for 10 weeks. He quit by changing his friends and
playground, basically he
got up, went to work and then locked himself in a hotel room for the
rest of the day and night.

Yes. Mark quit drinking but if you ask him he'll tell you this 'exile'
was like living in hell he says
that he was never more lonely or desperate for friendship in his life.
He'll also tell you that as soon
as he started going to A.A. his life changed and for the better, simply
because he has a place to
where people like him, help him stay sober and smile.

Kisses,
Bovi

Mias

11-22-2003, 12:30 AM

> "KevinB" <bovi999@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3FBEEFD0.CF18853D@hotmail.com...
> basically he
> got up, went to work and then locked himself in a hotel room for the
> rest of the day and night.
Hi Bovi - 'Locked' myself into my work and flat for seven years once when I
put the cork on the bottle using willpower. It was living hell. The worst
was the brainstorming at night blaming myself for all the insane things I
did and yearning for a drink to numb that memory and knowing that I could
not drink. Second worst was that my best company became my many character
defects that kept on haunting me and which I was unable to get rid of
without help. Third worst was the many people that I could not face and that
I had to hide from when in public. Fourth worst was the 'knowledge' that I
was insane cause only an insane person could think and act like I did. I
then saw alcoholism as a symptom only, of that insanity. Fifth worst was
looking and admiring 'normal' people who could drink and 'enjoy' themselves,
and people liked them. Sixth worst was the knowledge that alcohol had made
me lonely and has left me lonely. That was checkmate. Thank God that there
is a solution and that there is a way out of that special kind of hell. The
first time that I could say 'Hi - My name is Mias and I am an alcoholic'
will forever ramain the most precious moment in my life. It was then that I
gave myself a hug, for the first time in my life and that real recovery
could begin.
Mias
"KevinB" <bovi999@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3FBEEFD0.CF18853D@hotmail.com...
>
>
> I'm new to this group and want to share this with you. Just for the
> record I go to at least one
> if not two A.A. meetings a day and have 8.5 weeks of sobriety, which
> amazes not only me but
> my wife kids......
>
> I have a close A.A. friend we'll call him Mark, cause that's his name.
> Before coming to A.A.
> he had been sober for 10 weeks. He quit by changing his friends and
> playground, basically he
> got up, went to work and then locked himself in a hotel room for the
> rest of the day and night.
>
> Yes. Mark quit drinking but if you ask him he'll tell you this 'exile'
> was like living in hell he says
> that he was never more lonely or desperate for friendship in his life.
> He'll also tell you that as soon
> as he started going to A.A. his life changed and for the better, simply
> because he has a place to
> where people like him, help him stay sober and smile.
>
>
> Kisses,
> Bovi
>

Robert McGregor

11-22-2003, 01:00 AM

"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
news:bpmsal$aib$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> Hi Bovi - 'Locked' myself into my work and flat for seven years once when
I
> put the cork on the bottle using willpower. It was living hell. The worst
> was the brainstorming at night blaming myself for all the insane things I
> did and yearning for a drink to numb that memory and knowing that I could
> not drink. Second worst was that my best company became my many character
> defects that kept on haunting me and which I was unable to get rid of
> without help. Third worst was the many people that I could not face and
that
> I had to hide from when in public. Fourth worst was the 'knowledge' that I
> was insane cause only an insane person could think and act like I did. I
> then saw alcoholism as a symptom only, of that insanity. Fifth worst was
> looking and admiring 'normal' people who could drink and 'enjoy'
themselves,
> and people liked them. Sixth worst was the knowledge that alcohol had made
> me lonely and has left me lonely. That was checkmate. Thank God that there
> is a solution and that there is a way out of that special kind of hell.
The
> first time that I could say 'Hi - My name is Mias and I am an alcoholic'
> will forever ramain the most precious moment in my life. It was then that
I
> gave myself a hug, for the first time in my life and that real recovery
> could begin.
> Mias

From: "Mias" <emiasNOSPAM@NOSPAMnetactive.co.za>
Newsgroups: alt.recovery.addiction.alcoholism
Subject: Re: How much did it?
Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2003 05:32:52 +0200
Message-ID: <bhhk9k$n4g$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net>
>I would have
>to share my whole drunk story with you for you to understand that, when
>saying 'enjoying every second of sobriety' I am still downtoning it a bit!
>Where do I have to apply, in this group, if I want to express my happiness
>about not drinking? Please advise and I will do so if it is legit.
>Kind regards
>Mias
14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it.

Mias

11-22-2003, 01:26 AM

Robert - I am referring to seven years of hell, *BEFORE* I went to AA, when
I stopped drinking using willpower. If you can so aptly refer to my previous
posts you would know that unless you quote selectively from previous posts
in a manner to reach a devious, selfish goal. I am now 14 years clean and
sober, *AFTER* going to AA and am truly enjoying every second of it! The
seven years of stopping on willpower gives more shine to my joy. You will
not understand the loneliness of hell if you have not had the gates opened
so that you could come out and observe it from the outside. I hope that
those gates will open for you soon so that you too, can be joyous and be
grateful for that which probably saved your life. A fact which you seemingly
deny. I would also kindly ask you to stay of my back with your 'slightly
off' twisting and out of context quotes and replies to posts. I wish you
well and I wish you sobriety but have no need of you hammering *YOUR* bottle
and *YOUR* cork on my head. The way you quote from AA and denounce it in the
same breath gives rise to suspicion that you want to become the new founder
of 'Bob's AA'. I have news for you my mate, AA has been found and is working
extremely well with your life saved as one of the many millions of living
proofs. What you are doing, trying to change and denounce that which has
worked for you, is nothing new. It is however very selfish as you might be
keeping someone away from a solution. I challenge you to deny that AA has
not contributed the lion's share to the fact that you are alive today and
able to type your venom into the usergroups. And if you can do that
successfully, then stop quoting from AA literature to support 'the world
according to Robert'. You are at the very least dishonest in your unstated
quest for God knows what.
If you have a truth to state then do that and leave me be to state my
simple, uncomplicated truth as it worked for me. It is an insult to the
intelligence of the others here that you continue on your 'clinically dry'
path of denouncing and 'defending' AA in the same breath. I grant you
whatever philosophy or religion you adhere to, even if the office is
situated in hell.
Kind regards
Mias
14 Years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bpmtss$1oo3g0$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> news:bpmsal$aib$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > Hi Bovi - 'Locked' myself into my work and flat for seven years once
when
> I
> > put the cork on the bottle using willpower. It was living hell. The
worst
> > was the brainstorming at night blaming myself for all the insane things
I
> > did and yearning for a drink to numb that memory and knowing that I
could
> > not drink. Second worst was that my best company became my many
character
> > defects that kept on haunting me and which I was unable to get rid of
> > without help. Third worst was the many people that I could not face and
> that
> > I had to hide from when in public. Fourth worst was the 'knowledge' that
I
> > was insane cause only an insane person could think and act like I did. I
> > then saw alcoholism as a symptom only, of that insanity. Fifth worst was
> > looking and admiring 'normal' people who could drink and 'enjoy'
> themselves,
> > and people liked them. Sixth worst was the knowledge that alcohol had
made
> > me lonely and has left me lonely. That was checkmate. Thank God that
there
> > is a solution and that there is a way out of that special kind of hell.
> The
> > first time that I could say 'Hi - My name is Mias and I am an alcoholic'
> > will forever ramain the most precious moment in my life. It was then
that
> I
> > gave myself a hug, for the first time in my life and that real recovery
> > could begin.
> > Mias
>
> From: "Mias" <emiasNOSPAM@NOSPAMnetactive.co.za>
> Newsgroups: alt.recovery.addiction.alcoholism
> Subject: Re: How much did it?
> Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2003 05:32:52 +0200
> Message-ID: <bhhk9k$n4g$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net>
> >I would have
> >to share my whole drunk story with you for you to understand that, when
> >saying 'enjoying every second of sobriety' I am still downtoning it a
bit!
> >Where do I have to apply, in this group, if I want to express my
happiness
> >about not drinking? Please advise and I will do so if it is legit.
> >Kind regards
> >Mias
> 14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it.
>
>
>

Robert McGregor

11-22-2003, 02:23 AM

Wow, that pressed yer love and tolerance button, didn't it. Praise the lord.

Bob

"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
news:bpmvij$c06$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> Robert - I am referring to seven years of hell, *BEFORE* I went to AA,
when
> I stopped drinking using willpower. If you can so aptly refer to my
previous
> posts you would know that unless you quote selectively from previous posts
> in a manner to reach a devious, selfish goal. I am now 14 years clean and
> sober, *AFTER* going to AA and am truly enjoying every second of it! The
> seven years of stopping on willpower gives more shine to my joy. You will
> not understand the loneliness of hell if you have not had the gates opened
> so that you could come out and observe it from the outside. I hope that
> those gates will open for you soon so that you too, can be joyous and be
> grateful for that which probably saved your life. A fact which you
seemingly
> deny. I would also kindly ask you to stay of my back with your 'slightly
> off' twisting and out of context quotes and replies to posts. I wish you
> well and I wish you sobriety but have no need of you hammering *YOUR*
bottle
> and *YOUR* cork on my head. The way you quote from AA and denounce it in
the
> same breath gives rise to suspicion that you want to become the new
founder
> of 'Bob's AA'. I have news for you my mate, AA has been found and is
working
> extremely well with your life saved as one of the many millions of living
> proofs. What you are doing, trying to change and denounce that which has
> worked for you, is nothing new. It is however very selfish as you might be
> keeping someone away from a solution. I challenge you to deny that AA has
> not contributed the lion's share to the fact that you are alive today and
> able to type your venom into the usergroups. And if you can do that
> successfully, then stop quoting from AA literature to support 'the world
> according to Robert'. You are at the very least dishonest in your unstated
> quest for God knows what.
> If you have a truth to state then do that and leave me be to state my
> simple, uncomplicated truth as it worked for me. It is an insult to the
> intelligence of the others here that you continue on your 'clinically dry'
> path of denouncing and 'defending' AA in the same breath. I grant you
> whatever philosophy or religion you adhere to, even if the office is
> situated in hell.
> Kind regards
> Mias
> 14 Years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
> "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:bpmtss$1oo3g0$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >
> > "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> > news:bpmsal$aib$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > > Hi Bovi - 'Locked' myself into my work and flat for seven years once
> when
> > I
> > > put the cork on the bottle using willpower. It was living hell. The
> worst
> > > was the brainstorming at night blaming myself for all the insane
things
> I
> > > did and yearning for a drink to numb that memory and knowing that I
> could
> > > not drink. Second worst was that my best company became my many
> character
> > > defects that kept on haunting me and which I was unable to get rid of
> > > without help. Third worst was the many people that I could not face
and
> > that
> > > I had to hide from when in public. Fourth worst was the 'knowledge'
that
> I
> > > was insane cause only an insane person could think and act like I did.
I
> > > then saw alcoholism as a symptom only, of that insanity. Fifth worst
was
> > > looking and admiring 'normal' people who could drink and 'enjoy'
> > themselves,
> > > and people liked them. Sixth worst was the knowledge that alcohol had
> made
> > > me lonely and has left me lonely. That was checkmate. Thank God that
> there
> > > is a solution and that there is a way out of that special kind of
hell.
> > The
> > > first time that I could say 'Hi - My name is Mias and I am an
alcoholic'
> > > will forever ramain the most precious moment in my life. It was then
> that
> > I
> > > gave myself a hug, for the first time in my life and that real
recovery
> > > could begin.
> > > Mias
> >
> > From: "Mias" <emiasNOSPAM@NOSPAMnetactive.co.za>
> > Newsgroups: alt.recovery.addiction.alcoholism
> > Subject: Re: How much did it?
> > Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2003 05:32:52 +0200
> > Message-ID: <bhhk9k$n4g$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net>
> > >I would have
> > >to share my whole drunk story with you for you to understand that, when
> > >saying 'enjoying every second of sobriety' I am still downtoning it a
> bit!
> > >Where do I have to apply, in this group, if I want to express my
> happiness
> > >about not drinking? Please advise and I will do so if it is legit.
> > >Kind regards
> > >Mias
> > 14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it.
> >
> >
> >
>
>

Mias

11-22-2003, 02:34 AM

"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bpn2nh$1p8eqc$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Wow, that pressed yer love and tolerance button, didn't it. Praise the
lord.
>
> Bob
Yeah - Certain things have a way of bringing the worst out in me. I react
the same when I see a helpless person being mugged in a park or should a
mugger turns a bleak, watery eye upon me. I do suspect that I am not being
singled out for preferential treatment by you and that you attempt to
electronically mug everybody in a fair, equal and just manner? So - forgive
me if I take your cynical attitude personally.
Kind regards
Mias
14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!

Robert McGregor

11-22-2003, 03:09 AM

"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
news:bpn3iv$dih$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:bpn2nh$1p8eqc$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > Wow, that pressed yer love and tolerance button, didn't it. Praise the
> lord.
> >
> > Bob
> Yeah - Certain things have a way of bringing the worst out in me. I react
> the same when I see a helpless person being mugged in a park or should a
> mugger turns a bleak, watery eye upon me. I do suspect that I am not being
> singled out for preferential treatment by you and that you attempt to
> electronically mug everybody in a fair, equal and just manner? So -
forgive
> me if I take your cynical attitude personally.
> Kind regards
> Mias
> 14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
>
>
Electronically mugged? One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet is that
all have equal right of reply. You do remember we have previously discussed
your "enjoying every second of it" in as much detail as you cared to share
at the time? You would only have yourself to blame for your own seemingly
arrogant reticence here *if* I had added sarcasm to the repost of your own
words.

Oh well, you enjoy every second of it. Glad to be of service.

Bob

Mias

11-22-2003, 03:12 AM

"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bpn5ea$1q2pni$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Electronically mugged? One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet is
that
> all have equal right of reply.
Robert - all people have an equal right to walk in a park as well. Some do
however get mugged and some who walk there do the mugging. Given that
scenario, do you grant those that walk in the park their freedom to enjoy or
do you mug them to try and take away what is rightfully theirs? If it is the
latter then you should really not complain if the peaceful walkers object to
that in a peaceful manner strewing flower petals as they walketh.
Kind regards
Mias
14 Years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!

Robert McGregor

11-22-2003, 03:30 AM

"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
news:bpn5pk$e8q$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:bpn5ea$1q2pni$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > Electronically mugged? One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet is
> that
> > all have equal right of reply.
> Robert - all people have an equal right to walk in a park as well. Some do
> however get mugged and some who walk there do the mugging. Given that
> scenario, do you grant those that walk in the park their freedom to enjoy
or
> do you mug them to try and take away what is rightfully theirs? If it is
the
> latter then you should really not complain if the peaceful walkers object
to
> that in a peaceful manner strewing flower petals as they walketh.
> Kind regards
> Mias
> 14 Years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
>
>

People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh, get mugged
with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is rightfully
theirs??

Have you tried alt.recovery.paranoia ?

Bob

Mias

11-22-2003, 03:51 AM

"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bpn6m5$1qamjo$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh, get mugged
> with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is
rightfully
> theirs??
Robert - so we have established that you retain the right to mug. Why should
I look at alt.recovery.paranoia? Are you active there as well that you are
so well versed with the name? You crucify yourself with your own words
anyway when you say that "One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet is
that all have equal right of reply.". So all that is left for me is to try
to explain to you that that means EVERYBODY has the right and not just you.
Your name is *NOT* 'all'.
Kind regards
Mias
14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!

>
> "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> news:bpn5pk$e8q$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > news:bpn5ea$1q2pni$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > Electronically mugged? One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet is
> > that
> > > all have equal right of reply.
> > Robert - all people have an equal right to walk in a park as well. Some
do
> > however get mugged and some who walk there do the mugging. Given that
> > scenario, do you grant those that walk in the park their freedom to
enjoy
> or
> > do you mug them to try and take away what is rightfully theirs? If it is
> the
> > latter then you should really not complain if the peaceful walkers
object
> to
> > that in a peaceful manner strewing flower petals as they walketh.
> > Kind regards
> > Mias
> > 14 Years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
> >
> >
>
> People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh, get mugged
> with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is
rightfully
> theirs??
>
> Have you tried ?
>
> Bob
>
>

Mias

11-22-2003, 03:54 AM

Robert - We will have to stop having fun now. The rugby is starting. My five
bucks say that England is gonna beat the blue s...t out of you guys. Are you
on?
Enjoy the game!
Kind regards
Mias
14 Years clean and sober and enjoying every second of that and the World Cup
Rugby!
"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
news:bpn83e$f0s$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:bpn6m5$1qamjo$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh, get
mugged
> > with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is
> rightfully
> > theirs??
> Robert - so we have established that you retain the right to mug. Why
should
> I look at alt.recovery.paranoia? Are you active there as well that you are
> so well versed with the name? You crucify yourself with your own words
> anyway when you say that "One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet is
> that all have equal right of reply.". So all that is left for me is to try
> to explain to you that that means EVERYBODY has the right and not just
you.
> Your name is *NOT* 'all'.
> Kind regards
> Mias
> 14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
>
> >
> > "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> > news:bpn5pk$e8q$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > > news:bpn5ea$1q2pni$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > Electronically mugged? One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet
is
> > > that
> > > > all have equal right of reply.
> > > Robert - all people have an equal right to walk in a park as well.
Some
> do
> > > however get mugged and some who walk there do the mugging. Given that
> > > scenario, do you grant those that walk in the park their freedom to
> enjoy
> > or
> > > do you mug them to try and take away what is rightfully theirs? If it
is
> > the
> > > latter then you should really not complain if the peaceful walkers
> object
> > to
> > > that in a peaceful manner strewing flower petals as they walketh.
> > > Kind regards
> > > Mias
> > > 14 Years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
> > >
> > >
> >
> > People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh, get
mugged
> > with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is
> rightfully
> > theirs??
> >
> > Have you tried ?
> >
> > Bob
> >
> >
>
>

Robert McGregor

11-22-2003, 04:10 AM

"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
news:bpn883$f1m$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> Robert - We will have to stop having fun now. The rugby is starting. My
five
> bucks say that England is gonna beat the blue s...t out of you guys. Are
you
> on?
> Enjoy the game!
> Kind regards
> Mias
> 14 Years clean and sober and enjoying every second of that and the World
Cup
> Rugby!

Mias, I got married once, it put me right off gambling. The results of the
game will speak for themselves..

Bob

Robert McGregor

11-22-2003, 04:31 AM

"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
news:bpn83e$f0s$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:bpn6m5$1qamjo$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh, get
mugged
> > with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is
> rightfully
> > theirs??
> Robert - so we have established that you retain the right to mug. Why
should
> I look at alt.recovery.paranoia? Are you active there as well that you are
> so well versed with the name? You crucify yourself with your own words
> anyway when you say that "One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet is
> that all have equal right of reply.". So all that is left for me is to try
> to explain to you that that means EVERYBODY has the right and not just
you.
> Your name is *NOT* 'all'.

Given your right to through petals, and my right to point out their stench,
you used your initial right of reply to make unstabantiated allegations. Now
you are making more of them. There isn't a shred of evidence that I prohibit
replies, because I do not do so (although claiming to maintain AA purity or
some such bullshit, hackers have resorted to it next door at araa!)
Interesting though how your cohort rosie rushes in here with her shit that
is often so easily shown to be lies, then boasts of kill filling any
exposure.

At least you mostly stick to your own smarm.

Bob

Mias

11-22-2003, 04:32 AM

Robert - Twenty minutes into the game and England leads by 6 points to 5.
Way to go!!! I feel SO SAD for Australia...
Kind regards
Mias
14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bpna7n$1qs6c6$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> news:bpn83e$f0s$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > news:bpn6m5$1qamjo$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh, get
> mugged
> > > with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is
> > rightfully
> > > theirs??
> > Robert - so we have established that you retain the right to mug. Why
> should
> > I look at alt.recovery.paranoia? Are you active there as well that you
are
> > so well versed with the name? You crucify yourself with your own words
> > anyway when you say that "One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet
is
> > that all have equal right of reply.". So all that is left for me is to
try
> > to explain to you that that means EVERYBODY has the right and not just
> you.
> > Your name is *NOT* 'all'.
>
> Given your right to through petals, and my right to point out their
stench,
> you used your initial right of reply to make unstabantiated allegations.
Now
> you are making more of them. There isn't a shred of evidence that I
prohibit
> replies, because I do not do so (although claiming to maintain AA purity
or
> some such bullshit, hackers have resorted to it next door at araa!)
> Interesting though how your cohort rosie rushes in here with her shit that
> is often so easily shown to be lies, then boasts of kill filling any
> exposure.
>
> At least you mostly stick to your own smarm.
>
> Bob
>
>

Stacey

11-22-2003, 04:36 AM

Mias

11-22-2003, 05:00 AM

Robert - Halftime and England leads by 14 points to 5.
Good thing you got married!
Way to go!!! I feel EVEN SADDER for Australia...
(It is lekker to watch rugby sober)
Kind regards
Mias
14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!

"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bpna7n$1qs6c6$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> news:bpn83e$f0s$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > news:bpn6m5$1qamjo$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh, get
> mugged
> > > with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is
> > rightfully
> > > theirs??
> > Robert - so we have established that you retain the right to mug. Why
> should
> > I look at alt.recovery.paranoia? Are you active there as well that you
are
> > so well versed with the name? You crucify yourself with your own words
> > anyway when you say that "One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet
is
> > that all have equal right of reply.". So all that is left for me is to
try
> > to explain to you that that means EVERYBODY has the right and not just
> you.
> > Your name is *NOT* 'all'.
>
> Given your right to through petals, and my right to point out their
stench,
> you used your initial right of reply to make unstabantiated allegations.
Now
> you are making more of them. There isn't a shred of evidence that I
prohibit
> replies, because I do not do so (although claiming to maintain AA purity
or
> some such bullshit, hackers have resorted to it next door at araa!)
> Interesting though how your cohort rosie rushes in here with her shit that
> is often so easily shown to be lies, then boasts of kill filling any
> exposure.
>
> At least you mostly stick to your own smarm.
>
> Bob
>
>

Mias

11-22-2003, 06:58 AM

Robert - Fulltime plus 20 Minutes. What a game! Rugby won!
Kind regards
Mias
14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!

"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
news:bpnc59$g4a$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> Robert - Halftime and England leads by 14 points to 5.
> Good thing you got married!
> Way to go!!! I feel EVEN SADDER for Australia...
> (It is lekker to watch rugby sober)
> Kind regards
> Mias
> 14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
>
> "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:bpna7n$1qs6c6$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >
> > "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> > news:bpn83e$f0s$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > > news:bpn6m5$1qamjo$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh, get
> > mugged
> > > > with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is
> > > rightfully
> > > > theirs??
> > > Robert - so we have established that you retain the right to mug. Why
> > should
> > > I look at alt.recovery.paranoia? Are you active there as well that you
> are
> > > so well versed with the name? You crucify yourself with your own words
> > > anyway when you say that "One distinct beauty of the anarchy of Usenet
> is
> > > that all have equal right of reply.". So all that is left for me is to
> try
> > > to explain to you that that means EVERYBODY has the right and not just
> > you.
> > > Your name is *NOT* 'all'.
> >
> > Given your right to through petals, and my right to point out their
> stench,
> > you used your initial right of reply to make unstabantiated allegations.
> Now
> > you are making more of them. There isn't a shred of evidence that I
> prohibit
> > replies, because I do not do so (although claiming to maintain AA purity
> or
> > some such bullshit, hackers have resorted to it next door at araa!)
> > Interesting though how your cohort rosie rushes in here with her shit
that
> > is often so easily shown to be lies, then boasts of kill filling any
> > exposure.
> >
> > At least you mostly stick to your own smarm.
> >
> > Bob
> >
> >
>
>

Robert McGregor

11-22-2003, 07:15 AM

Can't say the poms didn't deserve that win!

Bob
"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
news:bpnj0s$i5i$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> Robert - Fulltime plus 20 Minutes. What a game! Rugby won!
> Kind regards
> Mias
> 14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
>
> "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> news:bpnc59$g4a$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > Robert - Halftime and England leads by 14 points to 5.
> > Good thing you got married!
> > Way to go!!! I feel EVEN SADDER for Australia...
> > (It is lekker to watch rugby sober)
> > Kind regards
> > Mias
> > 14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
> >
> > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > news:bpna7n$1qs6c6$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > >
> > > "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> > > news:bpn83e$f0s$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > > > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > > > news:bpn6m5$1qamjo$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > > People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh,
get
> > > mugged
> > > > > with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is
> > > > rightfully
> > > > > theirs??
> > > > Robert - so we have established that you retain the right to mug.
Why
> > > should
> > > > I look at alt.recovery.paranoia? Are you active there as well that
you
> > are
> > > > so well versed with the name? You crucify yourself with your own
words
> > > > anyway when you say that "One distinct beauty of the anarchy of
Usenet
> > is
> > > > that all have equal right of reply.". So all that is left for me is
to
> > try
> > > > to explain to you that that means EVERYBODY has the right and not
just
> > > you.
> > > > Your name is *NOT* 'all'.
> > >
> > > Given your right to through petals, and my right to point out their
> > stench,
> > > you used your initial right of reply to make unstabantiated
allegations.
> > Now
> > > you are making more of them. There isn't a shred of evidence that I
> > prohibit
> > > replies, because I do not do so (although claiming to maintain AA
purity
> > or
> > > some such bullshit, hackers have resorted to it next door at araa!)
> > > Interesting though how your cohort rosie rushes in here with her shit
> that
> > > is often so easily shown to be lies, then boasts of kill filling any
> > > exposure.
> > >
> > > At least you mostly stick to your own smarm.
> > >
> > > Bob
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

11-22-2003, 07:37 AM

"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
news:bpn883$f1m$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> Robert - We will have to stop having fun now. The rugby is starting.
My five
> bucks say that England is gonna beat the blue s...t out of you guys.
Are you
> on?
> Enjoy the game!
> Kind regards
> Mias
> 14 Years clean and sober and enjoying every second of that and the
World Cup
> Rugby!

Until the start of the second half, it looked as though we going to.
LOL Thank God for Jonny Wilkinson :^))

JB
(still cheering)

Jonathan Bratt

11-22-2003, 08:13 AM

In message <bpn5ea$1q2pni$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
>Glad to be of service.

We're waiting.
--
Jonathan Bratt

Jonathan Bratt

11-22-2003, 08:15 AM

In message <bpn83e$f0s$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net>, Mias
<emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> writes
>Robert - so we have established that you retain the right to mug. Why
>should I look at alt.recovery.paranoia? Are you active there as well
>that you are so well versed with the name? You crucify yourself with
>your own words anyway when you say that "One distinct beauty of the
>anarchy of Usenet is that all have equal right of reply.". So all that
>is left for me is to try to explain to you that that means EVERYBODY
>has the right and not just you.
>Your name is *NOT* 'all'.

Mias - ignore the little creep. He's bitter and twisted and gets off on
trying to bully people. Something really nasty has happened to the guy
at some point. Pity and ignore.
--
Jonathan Bratt

Jonathan Bratt

11-22-2003, 08:17 AM

In message <bpnm06$619$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB <JBCatRB@coldman.com>
writes
>
>"Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
>news:bpn883$f1m$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
>> Robert - We will have to stop having fun now. The rugby is starting.
>My five
>> bucks say that England is gonna beat the blue s...t out of you guys.
>Are you
>> on?
>> Enjoy the game!
>> Kind regards
>> Mias
>> 14 Years clean and sober and enjoying every second of that and the
>World Cup
>> Rugby!
>
>Until the start of the second half, it looked as though we going to.
>LOL Thank God for Jonny Wilkinson :^))
>
>JB
>(still cheering)
>
>
Can't blame the Aussies - someone forgot to remove the shackles b4 the
game ;-)
--
Jonathan Bratt

11-22-2003, 08:26 AM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:XFomwf5gH2v$Ew$G@aol.com...

JB wrote:

> >Until the start of the second half, it looked as though we going
to.
> >LOL Thank God for Jonny Wilkinson :^))
> >
> >JB
> >(still cheering)
> >
> >
> Can't blame the Aussies - someone forgot to remove the shackles b4
the
> game ;-)
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

What caused most of our players to lose their brains during the 2nd
half ? :^))

JB

Shawster

11-22-2003, 09:37 AM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:N1Bgsx4HG2v$Ewe7@aol.com...
> In message <bpn83e$f0s$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net>, Mias
> <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> writes
> >Robert - so we have established that you retain the right to mug. Why
> >should I look at alt.recovery.paranoia? Are you active there as well
> >that you are so well versed with the name? You crucify yourself with
> >your own words anyway when you say that "One distinct beauty of the
> >anarchy of Usenet is that all have equal right of reply.". So all that
> >is left for me is to try to explain to you that that means EVERYBODY
> >has the right and not just you.
> >Your name is *NOT* 'all'.
>
> Mias - ignore the little creep. He's bitter and twisted and gets off on
> trying to bully people. Something really nasty has happened to the guy
> at some point. Pity and ignore.

the epitome of the phrase "when someone points a finger there are three
pointed back at themselves"

thanks for the laugh.

Shawster

11-22-2003, 09:45 AM

> If you have a truth to state then do that and leave me be to state my
> simple, uncomplicated truth as it worked for me. It is an insult to the
> intelligence of the others here that you continue on your 'clinically dry'
> path of denouncing and 'defending' AA in the same breath. I grant you
> whatever philosophy or religion you adhere to, even if the office is
> situated in hell.

the thing about Bob is, for what you call truth, Bob will verify it. And
when he points out your contradictions, you can either accept that your
working model is flawed, or you can deny the *truth*

I have yet to see Bob bash AA. His program is based on the literature, and
is more rigorously honest than anyone that I have seen.

If you feel like you are getting mugged, work the steps on it. But then
again you don't need some smart mouthed newcomer pointing anything out to
you, do you?

Jonathan Bratt

11-22-2003, 10:11 AM

In message <bpnoqn$r99$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB <JBCatRB@coldman.com>
writes
>
>"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
>news:XFomwf5gH2v$Ew$G@aol.com...
>
>JB wrote:
>
>> >Until the start of the second half, it looked as though we going
>to.
>> >LOL Thank God for Jonny Wilkinson :^))
>> >
>> >JB
>> >(still cheering)
>> >
>> >
>> Can't blame the Aussies - someone forgot to remove the shackles b4
>the
>> game ;-)
>> --
>> Jonathan Bratt
>
>What caused most of our players to lose their brains during the 2nd
>half ? :^))

So as to make the convicts think they stood a chance - made it all the
more fun when we beat them.
--
Jonathan Bratt

Jonathan Bratt

11-22-2003, 10:13 AM

In message <TDKvb.24051$KI4.9093@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
<shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
>
>> If you have a truth to state then do that and leave me be to state my
>> simple, uncomplicated truth as it worked for me. It is an insult to the
>> intelligence of the others here that you continue on your 'clinically dry'
>> path of denouncing and 'defending' AA in the same breath. I grant you
>> whatever philosophy or religion you adhere to, even if the office is
>> situated in hell.
>
>
>the thing about Bob is, for what you call truth, Bob will verify it. And
>when he points out your contradictions, you can either accept that your
>working model is flawed, or you can deny the *truth*

Why does he seem unable to do so in a rational and civilised manner?

--
Jonathan Bratt

Mias

11-22-2003, 10:42 AM

It was touch and go and can't wait for France 2007
Kind regards
Mias
14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bpnjs0$1q51jo$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Can't say the poms didn't deserve that win!
>
> Bob
> "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> news:bpnj0s$i5i$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > Robert - Fulltime plus 20 Minutes. What a game! Rugby won!
> > Kind regards
> > Mias
> > 14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
> >
> > "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> > news:bpnc59$g4a$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > > Robert - Halftime and England leads by 14 points to 5.
> > > Good thing you got married!
> > > Way to go!!! I feel EVEN SADDER for Australia...
> > > (It is lekker to watch rugby sober)
> > > Kind regards
> > > Mias
> > > 14 years clean and sober and enjoying every second of it!
> > >
> > > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > > news:bpna7n$1qs6c6$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > >
> > > > "Mias" <emiasdont@spamnetactive.co.za> wrote in message
> > > > news:bpn83e$f0s$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> > > > > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > > > > news:bpn6m5$1qamjo$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > > > People walking in parks throwing flower petals as they walketh,
> get
> > > > mugged
> > > > > > with their own words by evil muggers trying to take away what is
> > > > > rightfully
> > > > > > theirs??
> > > > > Robert - so we have established that you retain the right to mug.
> Why
> > > > should
> > > > > I look at alt.recovery.paranoia? Are you active there as well that
> you
> > > are
> > > > > so well versed with the name? You crucify yourself with your own
> words
> > > > > anyway when you say that "One distinct beauty of the anarchy of
> Usenet
> > > is
> > > > > that all have equal right of reply.". So all that is left for me
is
> to
> > > try
> > > > > to explain to you that that means EVERYBODY has the right and not
> just
> > > > you.
> > > > > Your name is *NOT* 'all'.
> > > >
> > > > Given your right to through petals, and my right to point out their
> > > stench,
> > > > you used your initial right of reply to make unstabantiated
> allegations.
> > > Now
> > > > you are making more of them. There isn't a shred of evidence that I
> > > prohibit
> > > > replies, because I do not do so (although claiming to maintain AA
> purity
> > > or
> > > > some such bullshit, hackers have resorted to it next door at araa!)
> > > > Interesting though how your cohort rosie rushes in here with her
shit
> > that
> > > > is often so easily shown to be lies, then boasts of kill filling any
> > > > exposure.
> > > >
> > > > At least you mostly stick to your own smarm.
> > > >
> > > > Bob
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

11-22-2003, 10:59 AM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:Sb+HXeG5y3v$EwOX@aol.com...

> In message <bpnoqn$r99$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB
<JBCatRB@coldman.com>
<snip> > >What caused most of our players to lose their brains during
the 2nd
> >half ? :^))
>
> So as to make the convicts think they stood a chance - made it all
the
> more fun when we beat them.
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

IMO, that's rubbish. I think the pressure of the occasion got to our
guys. I am happy to pay tribute to the Aussie team's fighting spirit.

JB

Jonathan Bratt

11-22-2003, 12:07 PM

In message <bpo1sl$2gj$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB <JBCatRB@coldman.com>
writes
>
>"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
>news:Sb+HXeG5y3v$EwOX@aol.com...
>
>> In message <bpnoqn$r99$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB
><JBCatRB@coldman.com>
><snip> > >What caused most of our players to lose their brains during
>the 2nd
>> >half ? :^))
>>
>> So as to make the convicts think they stood a chance - made it all
>the
>> more fun when we beat them.
>> --
>> Jonathan Bratt
>
>IMO, that's rubbish. I think the pressure of the occasion got to our
>guys. I am happy to pay tribute to the Aussie team's fighting spirit.
>
>JB
>
>
My comment was humorous - hence the convicts reference. I would have had
no objection if the championship had been shared. England were simply
primus inter pares.
--
Jonathan Bratt

11-22-2003, 12:31 PM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:fihUpdYGf5v$EwMt@aol.com...
> In message <bpo1sl$2gj$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB
<JBCatRB@coldman.com>
> writes
<
snip>
> >> So as to make the convicts think they stood a chance - made it
all
> >the
> >> more fun when we beat them.
> >> --
> >> Jonathan Bratt
> >
> >IMO, that's rubbish. I think the pressure of the occasion got to
our
> >guys. I am happy to pay tribute to the Aussie team's fighting
spirit.
> >
> >JB
> >
> >
> My comment was humorous - hence the convicts reference. I would have
had
> no objection if the championship had been shared. England were
simply
> primus inter pares.
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

Clearly, we have a different sense of humour :^))

JB

Blue Moon

11-22-2003, 01:05 PM

On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:29:03 +0000 (UTC), "Plug"
<gluggaglug@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
>"The Other Harry" <hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
>news:sl2rrvc7mic99s6rs9f2c8q7etn7t3474o@4ax.com...
>> One thing that is wrong with newsgroup is that there is a
>> certain orthodoxy.
>
>I have never met such a disparate group in my life! That's possibly why I
>like it - all sorts of people - with all sorts of opinions - from all walks
>of life - at different stages of it. The only thing we all have in common
>is a desire not to drink.

I wouldn't even go so far as to say we have that in common. When I
first arrived here I had no such desire. Many others come here
wanting to drink moderately, or somehow stop life disrupting drink.

--
Blue Moon

Shawster

11-22-2003, 06:09 PM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:drKEb7Gq03v$EwND@aol.com...
> In message <TDKvb.24051$KI4.9093@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
> <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
> >
> >> If you have a truth to state then do that and leave me be to state my
> >> simple, uncomplicated truth as it worked for me. It is an insult to the
> >> intelligence of the others here that you continue on your 'clinically
dry'
> >> path of denouncing and 'defending' AA in the same breath. I grant you
> >> whatever philosophy or religion you adhere to, even if the office is
> >> situated in hell.
> >
> >
> >the thing about Bob is, for what you call truth, Bob will verify it. And
> >when he points out your contradictions, you can either accept that your
> >working model is flawed, or you can deny the *truth*
>
> Why does he seem unable to do so in a rational and civilised manner?

because you don't agree with what he says. if you agreed it would be fine.
I don't agree with smarmy irrational sentiment.

>
> --
> Jonathan Bratt
>

Jonathan Bratt

11-22-2003, 07:12 PM

In message <91Svb.27184$KI4.21@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
<shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
>
>"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
>news:drKEb7Gq03v$EwND@aol.com...
>> In message <TDKvb.24051$KI4.9093@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
>> <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
>> >
>> >> If you have a truth to state then do that and leave me be to state my
>> >> simple, uncomplicated truth as it worked for me. It is an insult to the
>> >> intelligence of the others here that you continue on your 'clinically
>dry'
>> >> path of denouncing and 'defending' AA in the same breath. I grant you
>> >> whatever philosophy or religion you adhere to, even if the office is
>> >> situated in hell.
>> >
>> >
>> >the thing about Bob is, for what you call truth, Bob will verify it. And
>> >when he points out your contradictions, you can either accept that your
>> >working model is flawed, or you can deny the *truth*
>>
>> Why does he seem unable to do so in a rational and civilised manner?
>
>because you don't agree with what he says. if you agreed it would be fine.
>I don't agree with smarmy irrational sentiment.
>
So he's rude to people who don't agree with him. Not a very adult
attitude.

--
Jonathan Bratt

rosie read and post

11-22-2003, 07:18 PM

> So he's rude to people who don't agree with him. Not a very adult
> attitude.
>
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

he has NEVER claimed to be an adult, or polite.

Robert McGregor

11-22-2003, 07:26 PM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:i4+7fio7t$v$Ewq0@aol.com...
> In message <91Svb.27184$KI4.21@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
> <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
> >
> >"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
> >news:drKEb7Gq03v$EwND@aol.com...
> >> In message <TDKvb.24051$KI4.9093@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
> >> <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
> >> >
> >> >> If you have a truth to state then do that and leave me be to state
my
> >> >> simple, uncomplicated truth as it worked for me. It is an insult to
the
> >> >> intelligence of the others here that you continue on your
'clinically
> >dry'
> >> >> path of denouncing and 'defending' AA in the same breath. I grant
you
> >> >> whatever philosophy or religion you adhere to, even if the office is
> >> >> situated in hell.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >the thing about Bob is, for what you call truth, Bob will verify it.
And
> >> >when he points out your contradictions, you can either accept that
your
> >> >working model is flawed, or you can deny the *truth*
> >>
> >> Why does he seem unable to do so in a rational and civilised manner?
> >
> >because you don't agree with what he says. if you agreed it would be
fine.
> >I don't agree with smarmy irrational sentiment.
> >
> So he's rude to people who don't agree with him. Not a very adult
> attitude.
>

Perhaps listening more closely to those who run your country, and their
allies, would enlighten you as to the effectiveness, rightly or wrongly, of
the vernacular

Bob

Robert McGregor

11-22-2003, 07:35 PM

"rosie read and post" <readandpost@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:H1Tvb.58494$Vu6.17987@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>
> > So he's rude to people who don't agree with him. Not a very adult
> > attitude.
> >
> > --
> > Jonathan Bratt
>
> he has NEVER claimed to be an adult, or polite.
>
>

http://blank.org/link/?q=1069547510

Jonathan Bratt

11-22-2003, 07:45 PM

In message <bpov70$1rdj7e$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
>
>"rosie read and post" <readandpost@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:H1Tvb.58494$Vu6.17987@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>
>> > So he's rude to people who don't agree with him. Not a very adult
>> > attitude.
>> >
>> > --
>> > Jonathan Bratt
>>
>> he has NEVER claimed to be an adult, or polite.
>>
>>
>
>http://blank.org/link/?q=1069547510
>
>
I don't demean you Robert - you do a very good job of that yourself.
--
Jonathan Bratt

Shawster

11-23-2003, 12:23 AM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:i4+7fio7t$v$Ewq0@aol.com...
> In message <91Svb.27184$KI4.21@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
> <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
> >
> >"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
> >news:drKEb7Gq03v$EwND@aol.com...
> >> In message <TDKvb.24051$KI4.9093@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
> >> <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
> >> >
> >> >> If you have a truth to state then do that and leave me be to state
my
> >> >> simple, uncomplicated truth as it worked for me. It is an insult to
the
> >> >> intelligence of the others here that you continue on your
'clinically
> >dry'
> >> >> path of denouncing and 'defending' AA in the same breath. I grant
you
> >> >> whatever philosophy or religion you adhere to, even if the office is
> >> >> situated in hell.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >the thing about Bob is, for what you call truth, Bob will verify it.
And
> >> >when he points out your contradictions, you can either accept that
your
> >> >working model is flawed, or you can deny the *truth*
> >>
> >> Why does he seem unable to do so in a rational and civilised manner?
> >
> >because you don't agree with what he says. if you agreed it would be
fine.
> >I don't agree with smarmy irrational sentiment.
> >
> So he's rude to people who don't agree with him. Not a very adult
> attitude.

no, your perception is skewed because he doesn't say exactly what you want
to hear.

>
> --
> Jonathan Bratt
>

Kai

11-23-2003, 03:22 AM

Shawster wrote:

> "Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:drKEb7Gq03v$EwND@aol.com...
>
>>In message <TDKvb.24051$KI4.9093@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
>><shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
>>>the thing about Bob is, for what you call truth, Bob will verify it. And
>>>when he points out your contradictions, you can either accept that your
>>>working model is flawed, or you can deny the *truth*
>>
>>Why does he seem unable to do so in a rational and civilised manner?
>
>
> because you don't agree with what he says. if you agreed it would be fine.
> I don't agree with smarmy irrational sentiment.

Is that why you keep constantly ridiculing homosexuals? What do you
have against them? Is heterosexuality a pre-requisite for 'real'
sobriety? Ever heard of tolerance or AA traditions?

Kai

Robert McGregor

11-23-2003, 03:37 AM

"Kai" <soberon@nospamo.luukku.com> wrote in message
news:bppqmj$7h5$1@phys-news1.kolumbus.fi...
> Shawster wrote:
>
> > "Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
> > news:drKEb7Gq03v$EwND@aol.com...
> >
> >>In message <TDKvb.24051$KI4.9093@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
> >><shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
> >>>the thing about Bob is, for what you call truth, Bob will verify it.
And
> >>>when he points out your contradictions, you can either accept that your
> >>>working model is flawed, or you can deny the *truth*
> >>
> >>Why does he seem unable to do so in a rational and civilised manner?
> >
> >
> > because you don't agree with what he says. if you agreed it would be
fine.
> > I don't agree with smarmy irrational sentiment.
>
> Is that why you keep constantly ridiculing homosexuals? What do you
> have against them? Is heterosexuality a pre-requisite for 'real'
> sobriety? Ever heard of tolerance or AA traditions?
>
> Kai
>

Jonathan is here as a faggot, as distinct from being here as an alcoholic.

Bob

Kai

11-23-2003, 03:42 AM

Robert McGregor wrote:

> "Kai" <soberon@nospamo.luukku.com> wrote in message
> news:bppqmj$7h5$1@phys-news1.kolumbus.fi...
>
>>Shawster wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
>>>news:drKEb7Gq03v$EwND@aol.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>>In message <TDKvb.24051$KI4.9093@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
>>>><shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
>>>>
>>>>>the thing about Bob is, for what you call truth, Bob will verify it.
>
> And
>
>>>>>when he points out your contradictions, you can either accept that your
>>>>>working model is flawed, or you can deny the *truth*
>>>>
>>>>Why does he seem unable to do so in a rational and civilised manner?
>>>
>>>
>>>because you don't agree with what he says. if you agreed it would be
>
> fine.
>
>>>I don't agree with smarmy irrational sentiment.
>>
>>Is that why you keep constantly ridiculing homosexuals? What do you
>>have against them? Is heterosexuality a pre-requisite for 'real'
>>sobriety? Ever heard of tolerance or AA traditions?
>>
>
> Jonathan is here as a faggot, as distinct from being here as an alcoholic.

And this, if it were so, would then explain the ridicule? I'm here as
an alcoholic, so I suppose I can expect to be ridiculed for my
alcoholism, then.

Kai

Robert McGregor

11-23-2003, 04:07 AM

"Kai" <soberon@nospamo.luukku.com> wrote in message
news:bpprsr$8qu$1@phys-news1.kolumbus.fi...
> Robert McGregor wrote:
>
> > "Kai" <soberon@nospamo.luukku.com> wrote in message
> > news:bppqmj$7h5$1@phys-news1.kolumbus.fi...
> >
> >>Shawster wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
> >>>news:drKEb7Gq03v$EwND@aol.com...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>In message <TDKvb.24051$KI4.9093@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
> >>>><shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
> >>>>
> >>>>>the thing about Bob is, for what you call truth, Bob will verify it.
> >
> > And
> >
> >>>>>when he points out your contradictions, you can either accept that
your
> >>>>>working model is flawed, or you can deny the *truth*
> >>>>
> >>>>Why does he seem unable to do so in a rational and civilised manner?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>because you don't agree with what he says. if you agreed it would be
> >
> > fine.
> >
> >>>I don't agree with smarmy irrational sentiment.
> >>
> >>Is that why you keep constantly ridiculing homosexuals? What do you
> >>have against them? Is heterosexuality a pre-requisite for 'real'
> >>sobriety? Ever heard of tolerance or AA traditions?
> >>
> >
> > Jonathan is here as a faggot, as distinct from being here as an
alcoholic.
>
> And this, if it were so, would then explain the ridicule? I'm here as
> an alcoholic, so I suppose I can expect to be ridiculed for my
> alcoholism, then.
>
> Kai
>

Given your commendable command of English, I'm sure you realise what
alt.recovery.addiction.alcoholism means

Bob

11-23-2003, 05:30 AM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:b$vFOiqA0Iw$EwFB@aol.com...
> In message <bpoumu$1qlaua$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
> McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
> >Perhaps listening more closely to those who run your country, and
their
> >allies, would enlighten you as to the effectiveness, rightly or
> >wrongly, of the vernacular
>
> It can indeed be effective when used sparingly McGoogle. It is not
that
> to which I was primarily referring, more to the overall tone, which
I
> find often to be one of superiority and hostility. I fail to see the
> point of this unless it meets a personal need of yours.
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

I wonder if you would care to also address your comments to Rosie :^))

JB

Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 05:33 AM

In message <bpoumu$1qlaua$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
>Perhaps listening more closely to those who run your country, and their
>allies, would enlighten you as to the effectiveness, rightly or
>wrongly, of the vernacular

It can indeed be effective when used sparingly McGoogle. It is not that
to which I was primarily referring, more to the overall tone, which I
find often to be one of superiority and hostility. I fail to see the
point of this unless it meets a personal need of yours.
--
Jonathan Bratt

Robert McGregor

11-23-2003, 05:46 AM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:b$vFOiqA0Iw$EwFB@aol.com...
> In message <bpoumu$1qlaua$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
> McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
> >Perhaps listening more closely to those who run your country, and their
> >allies, would enlighten you as to the effectiveness, rightly or
> >wrongly, of the vernacular
>
> It can indeed be effective when used sparingly McGoogle. It is not that
> to which I was primarily referring, more to the overall tone, which I
> find often to be one of superiority and hostility. I fail to see the
> point of this unless it meets a personal need of yours.
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

As you could be expected to be well aware by now, I could not give a rat's
arse about what you fail to see, even as your inane reply meets a personal
need of yours

Bob

Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 06:40 AM

In message <bpq2s4$l8l$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB <JBCatRB@coldman.com>
writes
>
>"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
>news:b$vFOiqA0Iw$EwFB@aol.com...
>> In message <bpoumu$1qlaua$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
>> McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
>> >Perhaps listening more closely to those who run your country, and
>their
>> >allies, would enlighten you as to the effectiveness, rightly or
>> >wrongly, of the vernacular
>>
>> It can indeed be effective when used sparingly McGoogle. It is not
>that
>> to which I was primarily referring, more to the overall tone, which
>I
>> find often to be one of superiority and hostility. I fail to see the
>> point of this unless it meets a personal need of yours.
>> --
>> Jonathan Bratt
>
>I wonder if you would care to also address your comments to Rosie :^))
>
>JB
>
>
I find rosie's occasionally hostile comments directed at the usual
suspects as indeed are mine - not to new posters to the group which is
what I find of McGoogle et al. Big difference. I would rather treat any
new poster to the group as genuine and try and assist/welcome them. Some
may be trolls but I would rather treat a few trolls seriously than lost
a single genuine poster. The cabal accused me of being a troll when I
first began to post - indeed I think so were you. Had I been of
different character I may well have decided to stop posting - that is my
problem with their style, that they may drive away someone who has
really come to seek help.
--
Jonathan Bratt

Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 06:41 AM

In message <bpq2vp$1r3vkv$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
>
>"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
>news:b$vFOiqA0Iw$EwFB@aol.com...
>> In message <bpoumu$1qlaua$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
>> McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
>> >Perhaps listening more closely to those who run your country, and their
>> >allies, would enlighten you as to the effectiveness, rightly or
>> >wrongly, of the vernacular
>>
>> It can indeed be effective when used sparingly McGoogle. It is not that
>> to which I was primarily referring, more to the overall tone, which I
>> find often to be one of superiority and hostility. I fail to see the
>> point of this unless it meets a personal need of yours.
>> --
>> Jonathan Bratt
>
>As you could be expected to be well aware by now, I could not give a rat's
>arse about what you fail to see, even as your inane reply meets a personal
>need of yours
>
>Bob
>
>
I doubt you give a rat's ass about much apart from your ego.
--
Jonathan Bratt

Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 06:42 AM

In message <bpprfb$1q276s$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
>Jonathan is here as a faggot, as distinct from being here as an
>alcoholic.

I never brought the subject up - it is you and your buddies who make
constant reference.
--
Jonathan Bratt

Robert McGregor

11-23-2003, 07:07 AM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:tYI43nxezJw$EwwG@aol.com...
> In message <bpq2vp$1r3vkv$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
> McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
> >
> >"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
> >news:b$vFOiqA0Iw$EwFB@aol.com...
> >> In message <bpoumu$1qlaua$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
> >> McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
> >> >Perhaps listening more closely to those who run your country, and
their
> >> >allies, would enlighten you as to the effectiveness, rightly or
> >> >wrongly, of the vernacular
> >>
> >> It can indeed be effective when used sparingly McGoogle. It is not that
> >> to which I was primarily referring, more to the overall tone, which I
> >> find often to be one of superiority and hostility. I fail to see the
> >> point of this unless it meets a personal need of yours.
> >> --
> >> Jonathan Bratt
> >
> >As you could be expected to be well aware by now, I could not give a
rat's
> >arse about what you fail to see, even as your inane reply meets a
personal
> >need of yours
> >
> >Bob
> >
> >
> I doubt you give a rat's ass about much apart from your ego.
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

Jeez, I did hope we were going to have a decent flame war. I suppose
standing up here means only that, perhaps tossing a few pansies at the
imagined bullies. At least Mias throws some nettles into the mix!

Bob the mongrel mugger

Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 07:14 AM

In message <bpprfb$1q276s$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
>
>"Kai" <soberon@nospamo.luukku.com> wrote in message
>news:bppqmj$7h5$1@phys-news1.kolumbus.fi...
>>
>> Is that why you keep constantly ridiculing homosexuals? What do you
>> have against them? Is heterosexuality a pre-requisite for 'real'
>> sobriety? Ever heard of tolerance or AA traditions?
>>
>> Kai
>>
>
>Jonathan is here as a faggot, as distinct from being here as an alcoholic.

Is that so? Let's see: my original comment about urine colour was *in
response* to another poster's comment about the subject. I said that
dark coloured urine can be a sign of dehydration and one should drink
more water. A reasonable comment in an alcohol ng, but this led to
certain others posters going on about keeping urine in the fridge and
drinking it - so who are the weird ones exactly?
--
Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 07:50 AM

"rosie read and post" <readandpost@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:za2wb.69217$Eq1.48344@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> jonathan,
> i also treated JB as a sincere newcomer when the JB posts started to
> appear.......................
> it didn't take long before the lies started to build up, and since
> being called on them, or ignored by me, JB has been added to my list
> of malcontents for the crap that is spewed by him/her.
>
> --
> read and post daily, it works!
> rosie
>
> to avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing.
> .......................elbert hubbard
>
ROFL. I am so not heartbroken by this news :^))

JB

rosie read and post

11-23-2003, 07:55 AM

> And this, if it were so, would then explain the ridicule? I'm here
as
> an alcoholic, so I suppose I can expect to be ridiculed for my
> alcoholism, then.
>
> Kai
>

only if you don't recover the MCGOOGLE way!

rosie read and post

11-23-2003, 07:59 AM

jonathan,
i also treated JB as a sincere newcomer when the JB posts started to
appear.......................
it didn't take long before the lies started to build up, and since
being called on them, or ignored by me, JB has been added to my list
of malcontents for the crap that is spewed by him/her.

--
read and post daily, it works!
rosie

to avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing.
........................elbert hubbard

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:m4w6$Nx8yJw$EwSs@aol.com...
> In message <bpq2s4$l8l$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB
<JBCatRB@coldman.com>
> writes
> >
> >"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
> >news:b$vFOiqA0Iw$EwFB@aol.com...
> >> In message <bpoumu$1qlaua$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>,
Robert
> >> McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
> >> >Perhaps listening more closely to those who run your country,
and
> >their
> >> >allies, would enlighten you as to the effectiveness, rightly
or
> >> >wrongly, of the vernacular
> >>
> >> It can indeed be effective when used sparingly McGoogle. It is
not
> >that
> >> to which I was primarily referring, more to the overall tone,
which
> >I
> >> find often to be one of superiority and hostility. I fail to
see the
> >> point of this unless it meets a personal need of yours.
> >> --
> >> Jonathan Bratt
> >
> >I wonder if you would care to also address your comments to Rosie
:^))
> >
> >JB
> >
> >
> I find rosie's occasionally hostile comments directed at the usual
> suspects as indeed are mine - not to new posters to the group
which is
> what I find of McGoogle et al. Big difference. I would rather
treat any
> new poster to the group as genuine and try and assist/welcome
them. Some
> may be trolls but I would rather treat a few trolls seriously than
lost
> a single genuine poster. The cabal accused me of being a troll
when I
> first began to post - indeed I think so were you. Had I been of
> different character I may well have decided to stop posting - that
is my
> problem with their style, that they may drive away someone who has
> really come to seek help.
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

Kai

11-23-2003, 08:05 AM

rosie read and post wrote:

>>And this, if it were so, would then explain the ridicule? I'm here
>
> as
>
>>an alcoholic, so I suppose I can expect to be ridiculed for my
>>alcoholism, then.
>>
>>Kai
>>
>
>
>
> only if you don't recover the MCGOOGLE way!
>

I consider myself 'recovered' to some extent. I do not drink, I am
perfectly capable of living my everyday life without the help of any
medication, and I do not engage in any 'insane' activities, unless
running long distances is considered one. I have no desire to drink,
let alone the obsessive craving I constantly had earlier in my life. I
enjoy my life's ups and downs sober, get pissed at things when things
get such that getting pissed at them is in order, and feel great
pleasure and heartbreaking love and gratitude when I look at my
five-year old daughter sleeping in peace. (I apologize to the
'rigorously honest smarm-haters' for the pain the previous sentence
may have caused)

Kai

Robert McGregor

11-23-2003, 08:11 AM

"rosie read and post" <readandpost@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:za2wb.69217$Eq1.48344@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> jonathan,
> i also treated JB as a sincere newcomer when the JB posts started to
> appear.......................
> it didn't take long before the lies started to build up, and since
> being called on them, or ignored by me, JB has been added to my list
> of malcontents for the crap that is spewed by him/her.
>
> --
> read and post daily, it works!
> rosie
"rosie read and post" <readandpostREMOVE@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:Gzchb.16789$%C5.9321@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Daily Reflections
>
> A SPIRITUAL AXIOM
>
> It is a spiritual axiom that every time we are disturbed, no
> matter what the cause, there is
> something wrong with us.
> 12 & 12, p. 90

Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 08:46 AM

In message <za2wb.69217$Eq1.48344@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com>, rosie read and
post <readandpost@yahoo.com> writes
>jonathan,
>i also treated JB as a sincere newcomer when the JB posts started to
>appear....................... it didn't take long before the lies
>started to build up, and since being called on them, or ignored by me,
>JB has been added to my list of malcontents for the crap that is spewed
>by him/her.

Yup - JB has been questioning and challenging my behaviour while
remaining conspicuously silent about that of the hate mongering cabal.
The latest is that she doesn't want to get involved. Anyone else see an
anomaly there?
--
Jonathan Bratt

Robert McGregor

11-23-2003, 09:03 AM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:q3+JcSEEpLw$EwTn@aol.com...
> Yup - JB has been questioning and challenging my behaviour while
> remaining conspicuously silent about that of the hate mongering cabal.

Hate mongering cabal???

Oh, the heterophobe and the grim reaper:-)

rosie read and post

11-23-2003, 09:04 AM

>...................and feel great
> pleasure and heartbreaking love and gratitude when I look at my
> five-year old daughter sleeping in peace.

thanks, that was beautiful!

--
read and post daily, it works!
rosie

to avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing.
........................elbert hubbard

"Kai" <soberon@nospamo.luukku.com> wrote in message
news:bpqb9s$1r7$1@phys-news1.kolumbus.fi...
> rosie read and post wrote:
>
> >>And this, if it were so, would then explain the ridicule? I'm
here
> >
> > as
> >
> >>an alcoholic, so I suppose I can expect to be ridiculed for my
> >>alcoholism, then.
> >>
> >>Kai
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > only if you don't recover the MCGOOGLE way!
> >
>
> I consider myself 'recovered' to some extent. I do not drink, I am
> perfectly capable of living my everyday life without the help of
any
> medication, and I do not engage in any 'insane' activities, unless
> running long distances is considered one. I have no desire to
drink,
> let alone the obsessive craving I constantly had earlier in my
life. I
> enjoy my life's ups and downs sober, get pissed at things when
things
> get such that getting pissed at them is in order, and feel great
> pleasure and heartbreaking love and gratitude when I look at my
> five-year old daughter sleeping in peace. (I apologize to the
> 'rigorously honest smarm-haters' for the pain the previous
sentence
> may have caused)
>
> Kai
>

11-23-2003, 09:08 AM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:q3+JcSEEpLw$EwTn@aol.com...
<snip>
> Yup - JB has been questioning and challenging my behaviour while
> remaining conspicuously silent about that of the hate mongering
cabal.
> The latest is that she doesn't want to get involved. Anyone else see
an
> anomaly there?
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

Johnathan,

FWIW, I think it is you who has been most upset by some of what has
been
said to you. I have tried to make you see that if you continue to
respond in the way that you do to remarks that you think insult you
and continue to harbour resentments about comments made about you in
the past - sometimes months - old- you will encourage further similar
comments. Whenever possible I try to rise above comments made about
me that I find either insulting or snide for example. When I do, I
gain instant peace of mind. When I have peace of mind, I don't want
to drink.

I have worked hard to achieve what I have today and at this time there
are things going on in the life I have outside this NG which
occasionally, make me think that unless I take great care, I shall
again start drinking. I will fight for causes that I believe I have a
chance of winning. I don't believe your cause is such a one.

Yours

JB

rosie read and post

11-23-2003, 09:12 AM

> The latest is that she doesn't want to get involved. Anyone else
see an
> anomaly there?
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

;)

Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 09:57 AM

In message <bpqehb$1rhrhk$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de>, Robert
McGregor <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> writes
>
>"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
>news:q3+JcSEEpLw$EwTn@aol.com...
>> Yup - JB has been questioning and challenging my behaviour while
>> remaining conspicuously silent about that of the hate mongering cabal.
>
>Hate mongering cabal???
>
>Oh, the heterophobe and the grim reaper:-)
>
>
You, Moonshine and Shyster.
--
Jonathan Bratt

Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 09:59 AM

In message <bpqfmo$n81$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB <JBCatRB@coldman.com>
writes
> I will fight for causes that I believe I have a chance of winning.
>I don't believe your cause is such a one.

Good job those who fought for female emancipation, Black civil rights
and gay rights did not share this view.
--
Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 10:33 AM

"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:fgv0JWHBtMw$Ewkv@aol.com...
> In message <bpqfmo$n81$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB
<JBCatRB@coldman.com>
> writes
> > I will fight for causes that I believe I have a chance of winning.
> >I don't believe your cause is such a one.
>
> Good job those who fought for female emancipation, Black civil
rights
> and gay rights did not share this view.
> --
> Jonathan Bratt

LOL, You forgot disability rights (which is my field)

JB

Jonathan Bratt

11-23-2003, 11:09 AM

In message <bpqkm1$r22$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB <JBCatRB@coldman.com>
writes
>
>"Jonathan Bratt" <jonnybratt@aol.com> wrote in message
>news:fgv0JWHBtMw$Ewkv@aol.com...
>> In message <bpqfmo$n81$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk>, JB
><JBCatRB@coldman.com>
>> writes
>> > I will fight for causes that I believe I have a chance of winning.
>> >I don't believe your cause is such a one.
>>
>> Good job those who fought for female emancipation, Black civil
>rights
>> and gay rights did not share this view.
>> --
>> Jonathan Bratt
>
>LOL, You forgot disability rights (which is my field)
>
>JB
>
>
Indeed, another one. Once I guess the cause of the disabled may well
have been considered hopeless.
--
Jonathan Bratt

Blue Moon

11-23-2003, 12:44 PM

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 12:59:11 GMT, "rosie read and post"
<readandpost@yahoo.com> wrote:

>jonathan,
>i also treated JB as a sincere newcomer when the JB posts started to
>appear.......................
>it didn't take long before the lies started to build up, and since
>being called on them, or ignored by me, JB has been added to my list
>of malcontents for the crap that is spewed by him/her.

Eh? Your lies were building up, and you were being called on them,
long before JB turned up. Although I've not read every post, I'm
unaware of any lies here from JB.

--
Blue Moon

11-23-2003, 01:05 PM

"Blue Moon" <mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:822ecbda5f88776dcc242867efa3e4a8@news.teranew s.com...
> On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 12:59:11 GMT, "rosie read and post"
> <readandpost@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >jonathan,
> >i also treated JB as a sincere newcomer when the JB posts started
to
> >appear.......................
> >it didn't take long before the lies started to build up, and since
> >being called on them, or ignored by me, JB has been added to my
list
> >of malcontents for the crap that is spewed by him/her.
>
> Eh? Your lies were building up, and you were being called on them,
> long before JB turned up. Although I've not read every post, I'm
> unaware of any lies here from JB.
>
> --
> Blue Moon

Hi,

When I first started posting here, I said a few things which I thought
I truly believed but discovered, when questioned, that I did not. For
example, I said that I had accepted my husband's drinking. When I was
asked why, if I had accepted it, I had made a crack about it one
night, I voluntarily re-examined myself.and discovered that I was
bothered by the fact that he could drink and control what he drank and
I couldn't. There may be a few other early posts where what I said
were words that came only out of my mouth and not from my mouth, head
and heart. Since I've been taught by people here the importance of
being rigorously honest with myself, I have tried to be. From this,
it follows that I always try my best to be always honest with you
guys.

Yours

JB

Robert McGregor

11-23-2003, 11:03 PM

"Kai" <soberon@nospamo.luukku.com> wrote in message
news:bpqb9s$1r7$1@phys-news1.kolumbus.fi...
I
> enjoy my life's ups and downs sober, get pissed at things when things
> get such that getting pissed at them is in order, and feel great
> pleasure and heartbreaking love and gratitude when I look at my
> five-year old daughter sleeping in peace. (I apologize to the
> 'rigorously honest smarm-haters' for the pain the previous sentence
> may have caused)
>
> Kai
>

Despite *not* swaddling your daughter in smarm, it was very heroic of you,
throwing your child into the flames. I guess old testament prophets would
have been proud of you.

Bob

Kai

11-24-2003, 05:21 AM

Robert McGregor wrote:

> "Kai" <soberon@nospamo.luukku.com> wrote in message
> news:bpqb9s$1r7$1@phys-news1.kolumbus.fi...
> I
>
>>enjoy my life's ups and downs sober, get pissed at things when things
>>get such that getting pissed at them is in order, and feel great
>>pleasure and heartbreaking love and gratitude when I look at my
>>five-year old daughter sleeping in peace. (I apologize to the
>>'rigorously honest smarm-haters' for the pain the previous sentence
>>may have caused)
>>
>>Kai
>>
>
>
> Despite *not* swaddling your daughter in smarm, it was very heroic of you,
> throwing your child into the flames. I guess old testament prophets would
> have been proud of you.

I have absolutely no idea of what you mean by this, Bob. But I do
presume it's meant to be insulting, and that you somehow disapprove of
me mentioning my daughter, or my love for her, in a post here. As for
"throwing my child into the flames", I just don't get it. Could you
please elaborate?

Kai