Curious..........

[Stacey]

Hi all,

How many of you had at least one parent who was an alcoholic? Or maybe even
a grandparent?


Stacey

[rosie read and post]

me!

--
read and post daily, it works!
rosie

in the practice of tolerance,
one's enemy is the best teacher.
...............................dalai lama







"Stacey" <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bpjgod$1pmmcv$1@ID-157974.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Hi all,
>
> How many of you had at least one parent who was an alcoholic? Or
maybe even
> a grandparent?
>
>
> Stacey
>
>

[Mark Warner]

Stacey wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> How many of you had at least one parent who was an alcoholic? Or
> maybe even a grandparent?


I can't blame it on my genes. I did it all on my own.

--
Mark Warner
lose .inhibitions when replying

[The Other Harry]

[On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:55:08 +1100, "Stacey"
<stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote:]

> How many of you had at least one parent who was an alcoholic? Or maybe even
> a grandparent?

I've got at least one parent. One and a half. I don't know
beyond that. I do think there is something in my family's
genes.

[Stacey]

So do I.. My father is an alcoholic, his father, and his father & mother
were alcoholics (my great grandparents), also my father's sister......... it
seems the odds are against me.

ho hum.



"The Other Harry" <hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:t5qqrvodkm3kpmra292ivslrohfqrpraav@4ax.com...
> [On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:55:08 +1100, "Stacey"
> <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote:]
>
> > How many of you had at least one parent who was an alcoholic? Or maybe
even
> > a grandparent?
>
> I've got at least one parent. One and a half. I don't know
> beyond that. I do think there is something in my family's
> genes.
>

[JB]

"Stacey" <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bpkkkp$1pkgma$1@ID-157974.news.uni-berlin.de...
> So do I.. My father is an alcoholic, his father, and his father &
mother
> were alcoholics (my great grandparents), also my father's
sister......... it
> seems the odds are against me.
>
> ho hum.

Only if you want them to be :^))

JB
>

> > [On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:55:08 +1100, "Stacey"
> > <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote:]
> >
> > > How many of you had at least one parent who was an alcoholic? Or
maybe
> even
> > > a grandparent?

[The Other Harry]

[On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 20:07:35 +1100, "Stacey"
<stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote:]

> So do I.. My father is an alcoholic, his father, and his father & mother
> were alcoholics (my great grandparents), also my father's sister......... it
> seems the odds are against me.

This is something I have discussed with my niece and with my
shrink. I do think there can be something that is "in the
genes".

My niece ran into a few problems herself, and she brought
this up to me. We won't be talking about her problems here.

Suffice it to say that I think there is a defective gene in
my family which leads us to psychological disorders which
makes us prone to alcoholism or to other forms of addiction.

I can stop drinking, but that gene is the real issue. It
always will be.

You take care.

[JB]

"The Other Harry" <hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:9l8srv848p2q8rboqdcr9ti239p45bp55a@4ax.com...
> [On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 20:07:35 +1100, "Stacey"
> <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote:]
>
<snip>

> I can stop drinking, but that gene is the real issue. It
> always will be.

Harry,

When you say you can "stop drinking" what time scale are you working
on ? Half an hour ? Two hours ? A day ?

JB

[The Other Harry]

[On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 15:18:35 -0000, "JB"
<JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote:]

> When you say you can "stop drinking" what time scale are you working
> on ? Half an hour ? Two hours ? A day ?

Three weeks seems to be about the bump. I have gone longer.
A few days is easy.

[Stacey]

"The Other Harry" <hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:9l8srv848p2q8rboqdcr9ti239p45bp55a@4ax.com...
> [On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 20:07:35 +1100, "Stacey"
> <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote:]
>
> > So do I.. My father is an alcoholic, his father, and his father &
mother
> > were alcoholics (my great grandparents), also my father's
sister......... it
> > seems the odds are against me.
>
> This is something I have discussed with my niece and with my
> shrink. I do think there can be something that is "in the
> genes".
>
> My niece ran into a few problems herself, and she brought
> this up to me. We won't be talking about her problems here.
>
> Suffice it to say that I think there is a defective gene in
> my family which leads us to psychological disorders which
> makes us prone to alcoholism or to other forms of addiction.
>
> I can stop drinking, but that gene is the real issue. It
> always will be.
>
> You take care.

I am trying to take care, I have had a rough time in my life the past 4-5
months have not been great - I noticed recently that i've been drinking a
hell of a lot, I couldn't get through a day without drinking! In the past
week, I just woke up and thought this has got to stop! So i stopped right
then, but I got so damn sick, muscle aches, headaches etc.

I'm not sure if I'm an alcoholic, but I do have a desire to stop drinking
and I am finding it difficult. A friend commented to me the other day that
I should have a couple of drinks because I'm less 'stressed' when I've had a
few. BAH!

I only have to think about my father and my aunty to not want to go down
that road though.

[Robert McGregor]

"Stacey" <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bpm6fa$1pglfq$1@ID-157974.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> I am trying to take care, I have had a rough time in my life the past 4-5
> months have not been great - I noticed recently that i've been drinking a
> hell of a lot, I couldn't get through a day without drinking! In the past
> week, I just woke up and thought this has got to stop! So i stopped right
> then, but I got so damn sick, muscle aches, headaches etc.
>
> I'm not sure if I'm an alcoholic, but I do have a desire to stop drinking
> and I am finding it difficult. A friend commented to me the other day
that
> I should have a couple of drinks because I'm less 'stressed' when I've had
a
> few. BAH!
>
> I only have to think about my father and my aunty to not want to go down
> that road though.
>
>

Have you read this book?

http://silkworth.net/bb/doctorsopinion.html

Bob

[Stacey]

"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bpm6nd$1q4ntm$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
>

>
> Have you read this book?
>
> http://silkworth.net/bb/doctorsopinion.html
>
No I haven't, is there something interesting in there i should read?

[Robert McGregor]

"Stacey" <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bpm7d9$1q042s$1@ID-157974.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:bpm6nd$1q4ntm$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >
>
> >
> > Have you read this book?
> >
> > http://silkworth.net/bb/doctorsopinion.html
> >
> No I haven't, is there something interesting in there i should read?
>
>

Despite documented errors of fact, I have never seen a more comprehensive
study, both professional, and lay, of alcoholism. Nor have I seen a more
appropriate, effective, and proven simple solution, for those who suffer
from alcoholism.

I have no idea whether or not you would find it interesting.

Bob

[The Other Harry]

[On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 10:18:02 +1100, "Stacey"
<stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote:]

> I am trying to take care, I have had a rough time in my life the past 4-5
> months have not been great - I noticed recently that i've been drinking a
> hell of a lot, I couldn't get through a day without drinking! In the past
> week, I just woke up and thought this has got to stop! So i stopped right
> then, but I got so damn sick, muscle aches, headaches etc.
>
> I'm not sure if I'm an alcoholic, but I do have a desire to stop drinking
> and I am finding it difficult. A friend commented to me the other day that
> I should have a couple of drinks because I'm less 'stressed' when I've had a
> few.

Well...

I don't know if you are an alcoholic either. I don't like the
term. I don't know the clinical definition of the term, and I
don't want to know it.

In my opinion, since you have found your way to this newsgroup,
you most likely have what I would call a "drinking problem". It
is affecting your life. So is mine affecting my life.

It only gets worse. Be warned about that. Hell 1 goes to Hell
2, and so on.

Do whatever you have to do.

[Stacey]

"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bpm99l$1g80gv$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Stacey" <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:bpm7d9$1q042s$1@ID-157974.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >
> > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > news:bpm6nd$1q4ntm$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > >
> >
> > >
> > > Have you read this book?
> > >
> > > http://silkworth.net/bb/doctorsopinion.html
> > >
> > No I haven't, is there something interesting in there i should read?
> >
> >
>
> Despite documented errors of fact, I have never seen a more comprehensive
> study, both professional, and lay, of alcoholism. Nor have I seen a more
> appropriate, effective, and proven simple solution, for those who suffer
> from alcoholism.
>
> I have no idea whether or not you would find it interesting.
>
G'day Bob

I've read the page you posted, interesting that this doctor say's that
alcohol is an allergy to some people. Also interesting reading that people
drink because they like the effect produced by alcohol. For me this is
true, for this time in my life, the troubles i've had of late, alcohol
deadens the hurt I feel. I just have to learn to deal with the hurt I
think.


Gettin' there...


Stacey

[Stacey]

"The Other Harry" <hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:vggtrvg7g5qcs5ei42l8klpb239d61gd8g@4ax.com...
> [On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 10:18:02 +1100, "Stacey"
> <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote:]
>
> > I am trying to take care, I have had a rough time in my life the past
4-5
> > months have not been great - I noticed recently that i've been drinking
a
> > hell of a lot, I couldn't get through a day without drinking! In the
past
> > week, I just woke up and thought this has got to stop! So i stopped
right
> > then, but I got so damn sick, muscle aches, headaches etc.
> >
> > I'm not sure if I'm an alcoholic, but I do have a desire to stop
drinking
> > and I am finding it difficult. A friend commented to me the other day
that
> > I should have a couple of drinks because I'm less 'stressed' when I've
had a
> > few.
>
> Well...
>
> I don't know if you are an alcoholic either. I don't like the
> term. I don't know the clinical definition of the term, and I
> don't want to know it.

Me either!

> In my opinion, since you have found your way to this newsgroup,
> you most likely have what I would call a "drinking problem". It
> is affecting your life. So is mine affecting my life.

Yup, agreed
>
> It only gets worse. Be warned about that. Hell 1 goes to Hell
> 2, and so on.

Warning bells are ringing, believe me!.
>
> Do whatever you have to do.

I'm doin it!

[Robert McGregor]

"Stacey" <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bpn9n3$1qhscd$1@ID-157974.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:bpm99l$1g80gv$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >
> > "Stacey" <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:bpm7d9$1q042s$1@ID-157974.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > >
> > > "Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > > news:bpm6nd$1q4ntm$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Have you read this book?
> > > >
> > > > http://silkworth.net/bb/doctorsopinion.html
> > > >
> > > No I haven't, is there something interesting in there i should read?
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Despite documented errors of fact, I have never seen a more
comprehensive
> > study, both professional, and lay, of alcoholism. Nor have I seen a more
> > appropriate, effective, and proven simple solution, for those who suffer
> > from alcoholism.
> >
> > I have no idea whether or not you would find it interesting.
> >
> G'day Bob
>
> I've read the page you posted, interesting that this doctor say's that
> alcohol is an allergy to some people. Also interesting reading that
people
> drink because they like the effect produced by alcohol. For me this is
> true, for this time in my life, the troubles i've had of late, alcohol
> deadens the hurt I feel. I just have to learn to deal with the hurt I
> think.
>
>
> Gettin' there...
>
>
> Stacey
>

G'Day again Stacey. I'm guessing you will find much that is just as
interesting if you click your way through the rest of the book. The hardback
copy, available at most public libraries, and from the Alcoholics Anonymous
organisation listed in most phone books worldwide, has a collection of
personal stories too.

There is also a downloadable copy to suit MS Windows @
http://www.onecom.net/michael.edwards/aa2.html

Bob

[Blue Moon]

On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 12:44:38 -0000, "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote:

>
>"Stacey" <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:bpkkkp$1pkgma$1@ID-157974.news.uni-berlin.de...
>> So do I.. My father is an alcoholic, his father, and his father &
>mother
>> were alcoholics (my great grandparents), also my father's
>sister......... it
>> seems the odds are against me.
>>
>> ho hum.
>
>Only if you want them to be :^))

If it's genetic (and there have been studies which do indicate it may
be), you can no more "want" away alcoholism than you can "want" away
hair colour. Nobody with cancer decided to have the cancer, yet when
it comes to alcoholism so many in society are still prone to treat it
as a moral issue. I find this *particularly* true of many people in
AA. Such people have either not read or not understood the most basic
literature of the society they claim saved their very lives.

So I do try to be careful what I say about this particular topic,
because it's so easily confused. Just like with the cancer patient,
each of us has a choice what to DO about it. But there's no point my
taking chemotherapy unless I have cancer.

Sure, some people get to be barking mad even without booze in the
equation. Others can drink successfully without feeling the "need" to
abuse the stuff. Unfortunately, despite the progress of science the
only way we have of knowing if we're unable to handle booze is to
drink the stuff, and the only way to determine alcoholism is to try
staying stopped after years of (perhaps subconsciously) using booze to
escape problems

This is where society really fails to accept its own moral
responsibility, and subsequently blames the drunk for the outcome....
most of western society actively encourages drinking, *including* in
times of emotional crisis.

--
Blue Moon

[Blue Moon]

On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:53:07 -0500, The Other Harry
<hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>[On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 15:18:35 -0000, "JB"
><JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote:]
>
>> When you say you can "stop drinking" what time scale are you working
>> on ? Half an hour ? Two hours ? A day ?
>
>Three weeks seems to be about the bump. I have gone longer.
>A few days is easy.

This is how it was for me, also. I had no clue how to live without
booze, either socially or emotionally.

When you take booze out of the equation and realise the truth, that's
when there's a chance ... I had no clue how to live, either socially
or emotionally.

--
Blue Moon

[Blue Moon]

On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 21:08:31 -0500, The Other Harry
<hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>I don't know if you are an alcoholic either. I don't like the
>term. I don't know the clinical definition of the term, and I
>don't want to know it.

Why not? A desire to maintain blissful ignorance or something? The
clinical definition is quite simple.

--
Blue Moon

[The Other Harry]

[On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 17:49:03 GMT, Blue Moon
<mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote:]

> This is how it was for me, also. I had no clue how to live without
> booze, either socially or emotionally.
>
> When you take booze out of the equation...

That's when I go right down the toilet.

> ... and realise the truth

What truth would that be?

> that's when there's a chance ... I had no clue how to live, either
> socially or emotionally.

I know I don't.

[The Other Harry]

[On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 17:49:03 GMT, Blue Moon
<mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote:]

> This is how it was for me, also. I had no clue how to live without
> booze, either socially or emotionally.
>
> When you take booze out of the equation and realise the truth, that's
> when there's a chance ... I had no clue how to live, either socially
> or emotionally.

I actually don't mean to be quite so flippant. This relates to
a discussion I have been having with myself. There is a big
"for me" part in there.

[The Other Harry]

[On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 17:52:28 GMT, Blue Moon
<mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote:]

> Why not? A desire to maintain blissful ignorance or something? The
> clinical definition is quite simple.

The definition which applies to me is not anything that I will
find in a book. It is personal.

[Blue Moon]

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 13:11:31 -0500, The Other Harry
<hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>[On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 17:49:03 GMT, Blue Moon
><mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote:]

>> ... and realise the truth
>
>What truth would that be?

The truth below...

>> I had no clue how to live, either
>> socially or emotionally.
>
>I know I don't.

--
Blue Moon

[JB]

"Blue Moon" <mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:6c2fbf5e7f68eaa39f025a59cf3f2e74@news.teranew s.com...
> On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 12:44:38 -0000, "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com>
wrote:
>
> >
> >"Stacey" <stacey_68@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >news:bpkkkp$1pkgma$1@ID-157974.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >> So do I.. My father is an alcoholic, his father, and his father &
> >mother
> >> were alcoholics (my great grandparents), also my father's
> >sister......... it
> >> seems the odds are against me.
> >>
> >> ho hum.
> >
> >Only if you want them to be :^))
>
> If it's genetic (and there have been studies which do indicate it
may
> be), you can no more "want" away alcoholism than you can "want" away
> hair colour. Nobody with cancer decided to have the cancer, yet
when
> it comes to alcoholism so many in society are still prone to treat
it
> as a moral issue. I find this *particularly* true of many people in
> AA. Such people have either not read or not understood the most
basic
> literature of the society they claim saved their very lives.
>
> So I do try to be careful what I say about this particular topic,
> because it's so easily confused. Just like with the cancer patient,
> each of us has a choice what to DO about it.

<snip>

> Blue Moon

Blue,

Thank you for furthering my understanding.

Stacey, I apologise for my flippant remark.

JB.

[Blue Moon]

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 13:25:42 -0500, The Other Harry
<hc.me@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>[On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 17:52:28 GMT, Blue Moon
><mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote:]
>
>> Why not? A desire to maintain blissful ignorance or something? The
>> clinical definition is quite simple.
>
>The definition which applies to me is not anything that I will
>find in a book. It is personal.

You may be amazed at how many truths are written about you, if you'd
just take the time to look.

However, in the meantime, "my case is different" remains one of the
most common perceptions amongst those who are quite simply alcoholic.

--
Blue Moon