View Full Version : 10-18-03
rosie read and post
10-18-2003, 08:01 AM
As Bill Sees It
Start by Forgiving, p. 151
The moment we ponder a twisted or broken relationship with
another
person, our emotions go on the defensive. To escape
looking at the
wrongs we have done another, we resentfully focus on the
wrong he
has done us. Triumphantly we seize upon his slightest
misbehavior as
the perfect excuse for minimizing or forgetting our own.
Right here we need to fetch ourselves up sharply. Let's
remember
that alcoholics are not the only ones bedeviled by sick
emotions. In
many instances we are really dealing with fellow sufferers,
people
whose woes we have increased.
If we are about to ask forgiveness for ourselves, why
shouldn't we
start out by forgiving them, one and all?
12 & 12, p. 78
************************************************** *********
Blue Moon
10-18-2003, 05:07 PM
On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 13:01:09 GMT, "rosie read and post"
<readandpostREMOVE@yahoo.com> wrote:
> The moment we ponder a twisted or broken relationship with
> another person, our emotions go on the defensive. To escape
> looking at the wrongs we have done another, we resentfully focus
> on the wrong he has done us. Triumphantly we seize upon his slightest
> misbehavior as the perfect excuse for minimizing or forgetting our own.
Just wondering if you ever read what you type.
--
Blue Moon
"Blue Moon" <mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:550d39339ffba7491590336db4498e29@news.teranew s.com...
> On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 13:01:09 GMT, "rosie read and post"
> <readandpostREMOVE@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > The moment we ponder a twisted or broken relationship with
> > another person, our emotions go on the defensive. To escape
> > looking at the wrongs we have done another, we resentfully focus
> > on the wrong he has done us. Triumphantly we seize upon his slightest
> > misbehavior as the perfect excuse for minimizing or forgetting our own.
>
> Just wondering if you ever read what you type.
>
> --
> Blue Moon
Blue,
Just wondering whether anyone who thinks they're perfect would take any notice :^))
JB
Shawster
10-19-2003, 10:36 AM
"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bmu3vg$hvd$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "Blue Moon" <mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:550d39339ffba7491590336db4498e29@news.teranew s.com...
> > On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 13:01:09 GMT, "rosie read and post"
> > <readandpostREMOVE@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > > The moment we ponder a twisted or broken relationship with
> > > another person, our emotions go on the defensive. To escape
> > > looking at the wrongs we have done another, we resentfully focus
> > > on the wrong he has done us. Triumphantly we seize upon his slightest
> > > misbehavior as the perfect excuse for minimizing or forgetting our
own.
> >
> > Just wondering if you ever read what you type.
> >
> > --
> > Blue Moon
>
> Blue,
>
> Just wondering whether anyone who thinks they're perfect would take any
notice :^))
we just keep chiseling at the walls of denial from the outside, hoping to
let the fresh breeze in.
>
> JB
>
>
>
"Shawster" <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:ocykb.178276$Of2.4609101@twister.tampabay.rr. com...
>
> "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> news:bmu3vg$hvd$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > "Blue Moon" <mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:550d39339ffba7491590336db4498e29@news.teranew s.com...
> > > On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 13:01:09 GMT, "rosie read and post"
> > > <readandpostREMOVE@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > The moment we ponder a twisted or broken relationship with
> > > > another person, our emotions go on the defensive. To escape
> > > > looking at the wrongs we have done another, we resentfully focus
> > > > on the wrong he has done us. Triumphantly we seize upon his slightest
> > > > misbehavior as the perfect excuse for minimizing or forgetting our
> own.
> > >
> > > Just wondering if you ever read what you type.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Blue Moon
> >
> > Blue,
> >
> > Just wondering whether anyone who thinks they're perfect would take any
> notice :^))
>
> we just keep chiseling at the walls of denial from the outside, hoping to
> let the fresh breeze in.
>
The thicker the walls, the longer this will take :^))
JB
>
> > Just wondering whether anyone who thinks they're perfect would take any
> notice :^))
>
> we just keep chiseling at the walls of denial from the outside, hoping to
> let the fresh breeze in.
>
The thicker the walls, the longer this will take :^))
JB
You guys and gals are speaking for or about yourselves and your walls or
opinions only, aren't you?
Might suggest you stop chiseling and start building. ;)
Shawster
10-20-2003, 07:43 AM
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vp6qj2ltunshb4@corp.supernews.com...
> >
> > > Just wondering whether anyone who thinks they're perfect would take
any
> > notice :^))
> >
> > we just keep chiseling at the walls of denial from the outside, hoping
to
> > let the fresh breeze in.
> >
> The thicker the walls, the longer this will take :^))
>
> JB
>
> You guys and gals are speaking for or about yourselves and your walls or
> opinions only, aren't you?
> Might suggest you stop chiseling and start building. ;)
we should start building?
I should build a wall of denial? my beliefs are correct, and I should not
let in new information?
Around the meetings I go to people are often grateful when other people call
them on their bullsh*t. I know I am grateful for people that didn't let me
get away with creating my own program, and made me stick to the book.
>
>
>
Blue Moon
10-20-2003, 11:30 AM
On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 23:53:49 -0500, "Gail"
<serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>You guys and gals are speaking for or about yourselves and your walls or
>opinions only, aren't you?
No.
Given that the original poster presents advice and suggestions
reproduced from a book, and given that the actions of said author can,
at least at times, seem to contradict said advice or suggestions, and
yet giving full consideration for the principle of "progress not
perfection", it is entirely in order to inquire whether the author
actually reads what is being reproduced.
This will make it clear whether the principle applied is less along
the lines of "progress not perfection" and more akin to "do as I say,
not as I do".
In which case, I would be opposed to either the saying or the doing.
I don't believe I'd suggest anything to anyone else that I'm not at
least willing to do, if not already done, myself.
>Might suggest you stop chiseling and start building. ;)
The answer itself seems notable by its absence, yet you would throw
stones at those asking reasonable questions? Perhaps your take on
"reasonable" differs from others' take on the word.
--
Blue Moon
"Shawster" <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:cMQkb.88688$Pd.1835274@twister.tampabay.rr.co m...
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vp6qj2ltunshb4@corp.supernews.com...
> > >
<snip
> > You guys and gals are speaking for or about yourselves and your walls or
> > opinions only, aren't you?
> > Might suggest you stop chiseling and start building. ;)
>
> we should start building?
>
> I should build a wall of denial? my beliefs are correct, and I should not
> let in new information?
>
> Around the meetings I go to people are often grateful when other people call
> them on their bullsh*t. I know I am grateful for people that didn't let me
> get away with creating my own program, and made me stick to the book.
>
I'm grateful for having discovered two days ago in "As Bill Sees It", the passage entitled "Welcome
Criticism". I quote only that part which has meaning for me::
"For myself, I have come to set a high value on the people who have criticized me, whether they have
seemed reasonable critics or unreasonable ones. Both have often restrained me from doing much worse
than I actually have done. The unreasonable ones have taught me, I hope, a little patience. But
the reasonable ones have always done a great job for all of AA - and have taught me many a valuable
lesson" (Letter, 1955)
Yours
JB
"Blue Moon" <mfoco_uk@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:da112ee3a2decd6798766126b248c6b2@news.teranew s.com...
> On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 23:53:49 -0500, "Gail"
> <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >You guys and gals are speaking for or about yourselves and your walls or
> >opinions only, aren't you?
>
> No.
>
> Given that the original poster presents advice and suggestions
> reproduced from a book, and given that the actions of said author can,
> at least at times, seem to contradict said advice or suggestions, and
> yet giving full consideration for the principle of "progress not
> perfection", it is entirely in order to inquire whether the author
> actually reads what is being reproduced.
>
> This will make it clear whether the principle applied is less along
> the lines of "progress not perfection" and more akin to "do as I say,
> not as I do".
>
> In which case, I would be opposed to either the saying or the doing.
> I don't believe I'd suggest anything to anyone else that I'm not at
> least willing to do, if not already done, myself.
>
> >Might suggest you stop chiseling and start building. ;)
>
> The answer itself seems notable by its absence, yet you would throw
> stones at those asking reasonable questions? Perhaps your take on
> "reasonable" differs from others' take on the word.
>
I don't understand. Is what Rosie is posting harming you all in any way?
Are there feelings in you all of helplessness in not having control over
what she post?
Does what Rosie post make you all angry or disturbed?
Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve because
someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
God, let it go..
> --
> Blue Moon
rosie read and post
10-20-2003, 05:38 PM
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vp8ojt2thmdabc@corp.supernews.com...
>
> Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve
because
> someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
>
> God, let it go..
are they still nitpicking in here?
LOL!
i think you hit "it" on the head when you mentioned that they might feel
a lack of respect coming from me......................all they ever seem
to do is argue............
how are you doing gail?
"rosie read and post" <readandpostREMOVE@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ltZkb.61348$832.52110@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vp8ojt2thmdabc@corp.supernews.com...
> >
>
>
> > Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> > Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve
> because
> > someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
> >
> > God, let it go..
>
>
> are they still nitpicking in here?
> LOL!
> i think you hit "it" on the head when you mentioned that they might feel
> a lack of respect coming from me......................all they ever seem
> to do is argue............
>
> how are you doing gail?
Rosie,
Your post leaves me needing no further proof to confirm my belief that you think you are perfect
:^)) LOL.
Yours
JB
Moonraker
10-20-2003, 08:49 PM
"rosie read and post" <readandpostREMOVE@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ltZkb.61348$832.52110@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>
>
> are they still nitpicking in here?
Now Rosie binBlabbin is feigning her killfile again. Acting like she
doesn't know what's being posted. Ha.
> LOL!
> i think you hit "it" on the head when you mentioned that they might feel
> a lack of respect coming from me..
I think somebody has hit "you" on the head if you think anybody worries
whether or not YOU respect them. What arrogance.
.....................all they ever seem
> to do is argue............
Were you expecting a few choruses of "Kum-by-ya", maybe?
Shawster
10-20-2003, 09:39 PM
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vp8ojt2thmdabc@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Blue Moon" <mfoco_uk@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:da112ee3a2decd6798766126b248c6b2@news.teranew s.com...
> > On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 23:53:49 -0500, "Gail"
> > <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > >You guys and gals are speaking for or about yourselves and your walls
or
> > >opinions only, aren't you?
> >
> > No.
> >
> > Given that the original poster presents advice and suggestions
> > reproduced from a book, and given that the actions of said author can,
> > at least at times, seem to contradict said advice or suggestions, and
> > yet giving full consideration for the principle of "progress not
> > perfection", it is entirely in order to inquire whether the author
> > actually reads what is being reproduced.
> >
> > This will make it clear whether the principle applied is less along
> > the lines of "progress not perfection" and more akin to "do as I say,
> > not as I do".
> >
> > In which case, I would be opposed to either the saying or the doing.
> > I don't believe I'd suggest anything to anyone else that I'm not at
> > least willing to do, if not already done, myself.
> >
> > >Might suggest you stop chiseling and start building. ;)
> >
> > The answer itself seems notable by its absence, yet you would throw
> > stones at those asking reasonable questions? Perhaps your take on
> > "reasonable" differs from others' take on the word.
> >
>
>
> I don't understand. Is what Rosie is posting harming you all in any way?
> Are there feelings in you all of helplessness in not having control over
> what she post?
> Does what Rosie post make you all angry or disturbed?
> Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve because
> someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
>
> God, let it go..
ROTFLMAO
oh hon, you are too young to have opinions.
have a pill you'll feel better (((((((((Frail)))))))))
my secret emails tell me you are in collusion against me. Maybe when you
are older you will understand why...
"rosie read and post" <readandpostREMOVE@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ltZkb.61348$832.52110@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vp8ojt2thmdabc@corp.supernews.com...
> >
>
>
> > Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> > Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve
> because
> > someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
> >
> > God, let it go..
>
>
> are they still nitpicking in here?
> LOL!
> i think you hit "it" on the head when you mentioned that they might feel
> a lack of respect coming from me......................all they ever seem
> to do is argue............
>
> how are you doing gail?
>
>
>
>
I am doing just great. Staying busy with this girl I am helping. We went to
her grandparents home this past weekend and stayed the night. The church
where she had attended when she was growing up gave her a baby shower. She
got so many things.
Tried to get some info on her about her condition and whether she was born
with this disability or whether it was an accident she was in at an early
age and/or abuse from an alcoholic/addict mother.
Her grandparents gave me pears, turnips and turnip greens and green
tomatoes. I was busy putting that in the freezer yesterday. They had cotton
fields next to their home and I got me a stem. I have seen cotton fields,
but never up close. Beautiful! Looked like snow.
Still going to the prison when I can.
Getting ready for a new baby girl in the house...LOL Never thought I would
say that again. It is getting close and exciting and even more after her
baby shower and all the little baby things.
Am doing really good and thank you for asking. Main thing is that I haven't
wanted a drink, no thoughts of drinking and never in a million years did I
ever expect to be volunteering in a prison or helping a fellow alcoholic in
her journey to a sober life. Feels good..;)
Best,
Gail
rosie read and post
10-21-2003, 07:36 AM
> Getting ready for a new baby girl in the house...LOL Never thought I
would
> say that again. It is getting close and exciting and even more after
her
> baby shower and all the little baby things.
sounds like fun.....................congrats to you for undertaking this
project, and supporting this women as you have.
amazing, and certainly something you or i wouldn't have been involved in
as drunks!
:)
> Am doing really good and thank you for asking.
well, thanks for taking the time to update us on your
growth...............your amazing!
>Main thing is that I haven't
> wanted a drink, no thoughts of drinking and never in a million years
did I
> ever expect to be volunteering in a prison or helping a fellow
alcoholic in
> her journey to a sober life. Feels good..;)
PROMISES pg80-82
(we will be amazed, before we are half way through................)
thanks for the update!
btw, i share your feelings about cotton plants, and remember clearly,
the first time i ever saw one!
:)
Blue Moon
10-22-2003, 10:08 AM
On Mon, 20 Oct 2003 17:32:25 -0500, "Gail"
<serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I don't understand. Is what Rosie is posting harming you all in any way?
Is what I am posting harming you in any way?
>Are there feelings in you all of helplessness in not having control over
>what she post?
Are you feeling helpless in not having control over what I post?
>Does what Rosie post make you all angry or disturbed?
Does what I post make you feel angry or disturbed?
>Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
>Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve because
>someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
Do you feel you are not getting the respect you deserve because
someone does not do or act the way you want them to?
>God, let it go..
God, practice what you preach.
--
Blue Moon
"Blue Moon" <mfoco_uk@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:c3aa81a2b169713f8fce0c9ddaafab00@news.teranew s.com...
> On Mon, 20 Oct 2003 17:32:25 -0500, "Gail"
> <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >I don't understand. Is what Rosie is posting harming you all in any way?
>
> Is what I am posting harming you in any way?
>
> >Are there feelings in you all of helplessness in not having control over
> >what she post?
>
> Are you feeling helpless in not having control over what I post?
>
> >Does what Rosie post make you all angry or disturbed?
>
> Does what I post make you feel angry or disturbed?
>
> >Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
>
> Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
>
> >Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve because
> >someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
>
> Do you feel you are not getting the respect you deserve because
> someone does not do or act the way you want them to?
>
> >God, let it go..
>
> God, practice what you preach.
>
> --
> Blue Moon
And you accuse Rosie of never giving a straight answer? I laughed at your
reply. Can you say the same? ;)
Best,
Gail
Blue Moon
10-22-2003, 01:23 PM
On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 12:48:46 -0500, "Gail"
<serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>And you accuse Rosie of never giving a straight answer? I laughed at your
>reply. Can you say the same? ;)
I was amused by your list of questions, hence the reply.
Given that I gave a straight answer in message
<da112ee3a2decd6798766126b248c6b2@news.teranews.com >, I fail to see
how much more straightforward you need answers to be.
--
Blue Moon
rosie read and post
10-22-2003, 02:07 PM
And you accuse Rosie of never giving a straight answer? I laughed at
your
reply. Can you say the same? ;)
Best,
Gail
actually gail, i DO give straight answers, BM and his "good old boys"
just don't like them...............
:)
LOL!
--
read and post daily, it works!
rosie
the more often I laugh today, the lighter my spirit will feel and. the
healthier my emotional life will become.
............................................karen casey
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vpdgo53ejoeb79@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Blue Moon" <mfoco_uk@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:c3aa81a2b169713f8fce0c9ddaafab00@news.teranew s.com...
> > On Mon, 20 Oct 2003 17:32:25 -0500, "Gail"
> > <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > >I don't understand. Is what Rosie is posting harming you all in any
way?
> >
> > Is what I am posting harming you in any way?
> >
> > >Are there feelings in you all of helplessness in not having control
over
> > >what she post?
> >
> > Are you feeling helpless in not having control over what I post?
> >
> > >Does what Rosie post make you all angry or disturbed?
> >
> > Does what I post make you feel angry or disturbed?
> >
> > >Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> >
> > Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> >
> > >Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve
because
> > >someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
> >
> > Do you feel you are not getting the respect you deserve because
> > someone does not do or act the way you want them to?
> >
> > >God, let it go..
> >
> > God, practice what you preach.
> >
> > --
> > Blue Moon
>
> And you accuse Rosie of never giving a straight answer? I laughed at
your
> reply. Can you say the same? ;)
>
> Best,
> Gail
>
>
And I thought I would get in the last word! I was wrong...;)
Have a good evening all,
Gail
"Blue Moon" <mfoco_uk@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4bab8d7cfd8907d79eb320843ec05768@news.teranew s.com...
> On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 12:48:46 -0500, "Gail"
> <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >And you accuse Rosie of never giving a straight answer? I laughed at your
> >reply. Can you say the same? ;)
>
> I was amused by your list of questions, hence the reply.
>
> Given that I gave a straight answer in message
> <da112ee3a2decd6798766126b248c6b2@news.teranews.com >, I fail to see
> how much more straightforward you need answers to be.
>
> --
> Blue Moon
"Shawster" <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:x%0lb.1445$Go5.54417@twister.tampabay.rr.com. ..
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vp8ojt2thmdabc@corp.supernews.com...
> >
> > "Blue Moon" <mfoco_uk@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
> > news:da112ee3a2decd6798766126b248c6b2@news.teranew s.com...
> > > On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 23:53:49 -0500, "Gail"
> > > <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >You guys and gals are speaking for or about yourselves and your walls
> or
> > > >opinions only, aren't you?
> > >
> > > No.
> > >
> > > Given that the original poster presents advice and suggestions
> > > reproduced from a book, and given that the actions of said author can,
> > > at least at times, seem to contradict said advice or suggestions, and
> > > yet giving full consideration for the principle of "progress not
> > > perfection", it is entirely in order to inquire whether the author
> > > actually reads what is being reproduced.
> > >
> > > This will make it clear whether the principle applied is less along
> > > the lines of "progress not perfection" and more akin to "do as I say,
> > > not as I do".
> > >
> > > In which case, I would be opposed to either the saying or the doing.
> > > I don't believe I'd suggest anything to anyone else that I'm not at
> > > least willing to do, if not already done, myself.
> > >
> > > >Might suggest you stop chiseling and start building. ;)
> > >
> > > The answer itself seems notable by its absence, yet you would throw
> > > stones at those asking reasonable questions? Perhaps your take on
> > > "reasonable" differs from others' take on the word.
> > >
> >
> >
> > I don't understand. Is what Rosie is posting harming you all in any way?
> > Are there feelings in you all of helplessness in not having control over
> > what she post?
> > Does what Rosie post make you all angry or disturbed?
> > Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> > Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve because
> > someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
> >
> > God, let it go..
>
> ROTFLMAO
>
> oh hon, you are too young to have opinions.
>
> have a pill you'll feel better (((((((((Frail)))))))))
>
> my secret emails tell me you are in collusion against me. Maybe when you
> are older you will understand why...
>
>
>
Shaw, did you just make a victim statement here?
Are you not working and facilitating people in a group where victim
statements are not allowed?
"Blue Moon" <mfoco_uk@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:c3aa81a2b169713f8fce0c9ddaafab00@news.teranew s.com...
> On Mon, 20 Oct 2003 17:32:25 -0500, "Gail"
> <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >I don't understand. Is what Rosie is posting harming you all in any way?
>
> Is what I am posting harming you in any way?
>
> >Are there feelings in you all of helplessness in not having control over
> >what she post?
>
> Are you feeling helpless in not having control over what I post?
>
> >Does what Rosie post make you all angry or disturbed?
>
> Does what I post make you feel angry or disturbed?
>
> >Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
>
> Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
>
> >Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve because
> >someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
>
> Do you feel you are not getting the respect you deserve because
> someone does not do or act the way you want them to?
>
> >God, let it go..
>
> God, practice what you preach.
>
> --
> Blue Moon
I wasn't preaching. Only asking a question that you appear not to have any
knowledge about and that would be anger and what causes our anger and how we
react to anger. Plus, being able to identify our body sensations and
behaviors before we get so angry that we do something or say something that
can harm yourself or another person.
What are some of the body sensations and behavior's you have and display
when starting to get angry? Honest question to you, Shaw and some other ng
members. .
rosie read and post
10-22-2003, 03:54 PM
> Shaw, did you just make a victim statement here?
> Are you not working and facilitating people in a group where victim
> statements are not allowed?
>
>
ROTFLMAO!
"rosie read and post" <readandpostTAKEOUT@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:BzAlb.64459$pg7.44045@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> And you accuse Rosie of never giving a straight answer? I laughed at
> your
> reply. Can you say the same? ;)
>
> Best,
> Gail
>
>
> actually gail, i DO give straight answers, BM and his "good old boys"
> just don't like them...............
> :)
> LOL!
Always ?. LOL
JB
Shawster
10-22-2003, 10:09 PM
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vpdq568c3qrvc7@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Shawster" <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:x%0lb.1445$Go5.54417@twister.tampabay.rr.com. ..
> >
> > "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:vp8ojt2thmdabc@corp.supernews.com...
> > >
> > > "Blue Moon" <mfoco_uk@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
> > > news:da112ee3a2decd6798766126b248c6b2@news.teranew s.com...
> > > > On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 23:53:49 -0500, "Gail"
> > > > <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >You guys and gals are speaking for or about yourselves and your
walls
> > or
> > > > >opinions only, aren't you?
> > > >
> > > > No.
> > > >
> > > > Given that the original poster presents advice and suggestions
> > > > reproduced from a book, and given that the actions of said author
can,
> > > > at least at times, seem to contradict said advice or suggestions,
and
> > > > yet giving full consideration for the principle of "progress not
> > > > perfection", it is entirely in order to inquire whether the author
> > > > actually reads what is being reproduced.
> > > >
> > > > This will make it clear whether the principle applied is less along
> > > > the lines of "progress not perfection" and more akin to "do as I
say,
> > > > not as I do".
> > > >
> > > > In which case, I would be opposed to either the saying or the doing.
> > > > I don't believe I'd suggest anything to anyone else that I'm not at
> > > > least willing to do, if not already done, myself.
> > > >
> > > > >Might suggest you stop chiseling and start building. ;)
> > > >
> > > > The answer itself seems notable by its absence, yet you would throw
> > > > stones at those asking reasonable questions? Perhaps your take on
> > > > "reasonable" differs from others' take on the word.
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I don't understand. Is what Rosie is posting harming you all in any
way?
> > > Are there feelings in you all of helplessness in not having control
over
> > > what she post?
> > > Does what Rosie post make you all angry or disturbed?
> > > Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> > > Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve
because
> > > someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
> > >
> > > God, let it go..
> >
> > ROTFLMAO
> >
> > oh hon, you are too young to have opinions.
> >
> > have a pill you'll feel better (((((((((Frail)))))))))
> >
> > my secret emails tell me you are in collusion against me. Maybe when
you
> > are older you will understand why...
> >
> >
> >
>
> Shaw, did you just make a victim statement here?
> Are you not working and facilitating people in a group where victim
> statements are not allowed?
actually, it was sarcasm. fairly thick.
hey, don't blow my cover. and I don't work with the victims. The
batterer's do make a lot of victim statements, and then I laugh. we had an
awesome group tonight. I think a few of the guys took ownership of their
lives, for once.
>
>
>
Shawster
10-22-2003, 10:30 PM
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vpdqh2jqe0c6a8@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Blue Moon" <mfoco_uk@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:c3aa81a2b169713f8fce0c9ddaafab00@news.teranew s.com...
> > On Mon, 20 Oct 2003 17:32:25 -0500, "Gail"
> > <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > >I don't understand. Is what Rosie is posting harming you all in any
way?
> >
> > Is what I am posting harming you in any way?
> >
> > >Are there feelings in you all of helplessness in not having control
over
> > >what she post?
> >
> > Are you feeling helpless in not having control over what I post?
> >
> > >Does what Rosie post make you all angry or disturbed?
> >
> > Does what I post make you feel angry or disturbed?
> >
> > >Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> >
> > Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> >
> > >Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve because
> > >someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
> >
> > Do you feel you are not getting the respect you deserve because
> > someone does not do or act the way you want them to?
> >
> > >God, let it go..
> >
> > God, practice what you preach.
> >
> > --
> > Blue Moon
>
> I wasn't preaching. Only asking a question that you appear not to have any
> knowledge about and that would be anger and what causes our anger and how
we
> react to anger. Plus, being able to identify our body sensations and
> behaviors before we get so angry that we do something or say something
that
> can harm yourself or another person.
> What are some of the body sensations and behavior's you have and display
> when starting to get angry? Honest question to you, Shaw and some other ng
> members. .
I'll field this one...
rising heart rate, flush face, shallow breathing, tensing muscles,
aggressive posturing.
Personally the first sign that I am getting angry is that I start to breathe
through my nose rather than my mouth.
So I hope it is clear that I understand a little about anger and the
physical aspect. Maybe that will add credability to my claim that I do not
get angry when Rosie posts.
I will readily admit that I feel hurt when someone posts a lie and is
purposely cruel in those lies when they are directed at me. But I can get
over that. It really is not my business what people think of me. I'm a big
enough boy to get over any feelings of hurt and betrayal. But I absolutely
do not have to accept what they say, or accept it as true.
I keep an open mind, and see whether someone is giving me honest criticism,
and is helping me by pointing oput my errors. Or, are they just
condescending, mocking, belittling, and being dishonest. If I were in pity
and wanted some collusion, I could fully expect my true friends to laugh at
my face. But when someone laughs at me sharing my experience with the
steps, I do not accept that. I feel that is malicious. And since i already
have a great lack of respect for her, I do not get angry, I simply set my
boundry firmly (albeit rather rudely) and cut off communication. I have
that right.
so if there is a ROTFLMAO or a ((((((((((((((good ol' boy))))))))))
following this post, then it absolutely proves my point. but we are well
beyond that, and what she does absolutely does not reflect upon me.
PAX
REV
ps. stop echoing, blue. it gives me the creeps. You sound like HAL. ;o)
>
>
>
Blue Moon
10-22-2003, 11:11 PM
On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 15:35:39 -0500, "Gail"
<serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I wasn't preaching. Only asking a question that you appear not to have any
>knowledge about and that would be anger and what causes our anger and how we
>react to anger.
Anger? Er...ok.
>Plus, being able to identify our body sensations and
>behaviors before we get so angry that we do something or say something that
>can harm yourself or another person.
Are we talking about righteous anger, or irrational anger, or just
anger?
>What are some of the body sensations and behavior's you have and display
>when starting to get angry?
That can depend on the cause of anger, and the behaviour of the other
person (anger usually involves someone else). When an angry person is
causing anger, I ignore them. .I'll even walk away. Reacting angrily
to anger can be just volatile. That's not to say I don't do it, but
I've not known the outcome be any other than volatile.
Sometimes I might be in a situation where I'm needing to assert
myself, at work for example. At such times I stick to the point and
work hard not to get drawn into anything personal. If others cannot
do likewise, it's again a situation I don't buy into.
Irrational anger can be a little different. It seems not always
triggered by immediate people or situations, but perhaps brews with
stress. At such times I'm not always aware of the stress until the
anger happens, then I tend to feel rather stupid (which can itself
make me feel angry...).
It can be awfully tempting to retaliate, usually to "prove" a point.
However, that doesn't seem to work out too well either.
Rational or otherwise, when I'm feeling out of control with anger I
work Step 10 - take some time out, and turn my thoughts resolutely to
someone I can help. That seems to channel my mental energy in a
different direction.
--
Blue Moon
"Shawster" <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:0EHlb.22213$Go5.331547@twister.tampabay.rr.co m...
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vpdq568c3qrvc7@corp.supernews.com...
> >
> > "Shawster" <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
> > news:x%0lb.1445$Go5.54417@twister.tampabay.rr.com. ..
> > >
> > > "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > > news:vp8ojt2thmdabc@corp.supernews.com...
> > > >
> > > > "Blue Moon" <mfoco_uk@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
> > > > news:da112ee3a2decd6798766126b248c6b2@news.teranew s.com...
> > > > > On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 23:53:49 -0500, "Gail"
> > > > > <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >You guys and gals are speaking for or about yourselves and your
> walls
> > > or
> > > > > >opinions only, aren't you?
> > > > >
> > > > > No.
> > > > >
> > > > > Given that the original poster presents advice and suggestions
> > > > > reproduced from a book, and given that the actions of said author
> can,
> > > > > at least at times, seem to contradict said advice or suggestions,
> and
> > > > > yet giving full consideration for the principle of "progress not
> > > > > perfection", it is entirely in order to inquire whether the author
> > > > > actually reads what is being reproduced.
> > > > >
> > > > > This will make it clear whether the principle applied is less
along
> > > > > the lines of "progress not perfection" and more akin to "do as I
> say,
> > > > > not as I do".
> > > > >
> > > > > In which case, I would be opposed to either the saying or the
doing.
> > > > > I don't believe I'd suggest anything to anyone else that I'm not
at
> > > > > least willing to do, if not already done, myself.
> > > > >
> > > > > >Might suggest you stop chiseling and start building. ;)
> > > > >
> > > > > The answer itself seems notable by its absence, yet you would
throw
> > > > > stones at those asking reasonable questions? Perhaps your take on
> > > > > "reasonable" differs from others' take on the word.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I don't understand. Is what Rosie is posting harming you all in any
> way?
> > > > Are there feelings in you all of helplessness in not having control
> over
> > > > what she post?
> > > > Does what Rosie post make you all angry or disturbed?
> > > > Why should everything turn out the way you all want it to?
> > > > Do you all feel you are not getting the respect you all deserve
> because
> > > > someone does not do or act the way you all want them to?
> > > >
> > > > God, let it go..
> > >
> > > ROTFLMAO
> > >
> > > oh hon, you are too young to have opinions.
> > >
> > > have a pill you'll feel better (((((((((Frail)))))))))
> > >
> > > my secret emails tell me you are in collusion against me. Maybe when
> you
> > > are older you will understand why...
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Shaw, did you just make a victim statement here?
> > Are you not working and facilitating people in a group where victim
> > statements are not allowed?
>
> actually, it was sarcasm. fairly thick.
>
> hey, don't blow my cover. and I don't work with the victims. The
> batterer's do make a lot of victim statements, and then I laugh. we had
an
> awesome group tonight. I think a few of the guys took ownership of their
> lives, for once.
> >
That is great. If one person in the group takes ownership, that is something
to be commended. When I was doing the anger management groups, none of them
had a problem with anger...LOL If, so and so hadn't done this or that,
they wouldn't have got mad and done what they did to get them on probation.
I assume it is about the same in domestic violence. None of them ever hit
anyone unless they were provoked, so it wasn't their fault? ;)
You do know how to recognize when you are getting angry, don't you? I have
been taking a refresher course myself...:)
Best,
Gail
"Blue Moon" <mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a66960b9104e37b986cffdfaed2ac15f@news.teranew s.com...
> On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 15:35:39 -0500, "Gail"
> <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >I wasn't preaching. Only asking a question that you appear not to have
any
> >knowledge about and that would be anger and what causes our anger and how
we
> >react to anger.
>
> Anger? Er...ok.
>
> >Plus, being able to identify our body sensations and
> >behaviors before we get so angry that we do something or say something
that
> >can harm yourself or another person.
>
> Are we talking about righteous anger, or irrational anger, or just
> anger?
>
> >What are some of the body sensations and behavior's you have and display
> >when starting to get angry?
>
> That can depend on the cause of anger, and the behaviour of the other
> person (anger usually involves someone else). When an angry person is
> causing anger, I ignore them. .I'll even walk away. Reacting angrily
> to anger can be just volatile. That's not to say I don't do it, but
> I've not known the outcome be any other than volatile.
>
> Sometimes I might be in a situation where I'm needing to assert
> myself, at work for example. At such times I stick to the point and
> work hard not to get drawn into anything personal. If others cannot
> do likewise, it's again a situation I don't buy into.
>
> Irrational anger can be a little different. It seems not always
> triggered by immediate people or situations, but perhaps brews with
> stress. At such times I'm not always aware of the stress until the
> anger happens, then I tend to feel rather stupid (which can itself
> make me feel angry...).
>
> It can be awfully tempting to retaliate, usually to "prove" a point.
> However, that doesn't seem to work out too well either.
>
> Rational or otherwise, when I'm feeling out of control with anger I
> work Step 10 - take some time out, and turn my thoughts resolutely to
> someone I can help. That seems to channel my mental energy in a
> different direction.
>
> --
> Blue Moon
Thank you for your reply.
I guess I have to admit I get irritated at seeing some in this group do
their best to provoke, condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done
that.;) Is that irrational anger? I know it is irrational thinking to think
that I can control what they say or how they react, BUT GOD, I WOULD LIKE
TO! LOL
Best,
Gail
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:vpep5i1e9uil71@corp.supernews.com...
<snip>
>
> Thank you for your reply.
>
> I guess I have to admit I get irritated at seeing some in this group do
> their best to provoke, condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done
> that.;) Is that irrational anger? I know it is irrational thinking to think
> that I can control what they say or how they react, BUT GOD, I WOULD LIKE
> TO! LOL
>
> Best,
> Gail
>
Gail,
I'm thinking that you *still* sometimes do what you've just said others do :^))
JB
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:vpep5i1e9uil71@corp.supernews.com...
<snip>
>
> Thank you for your reply.
>
> I guess I have to admit I get irritated at seeing some in this group do
> their best to provoke, condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done
> that.;) Is that irrational anger? I know it is irrational thinking to think
> that I can control what they say or how they react, BUT GOD, I WOULD LIKE
> TO! LOL
>
> Best,
> Gail
>
Gail,
I'm thinking that you *still* sometimes do what you've just said others do :^))
JB
"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bn7sfn$8je$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vpep5i1e9uil71@corp.supernews.com...
> <snip>
> >
> > Thank you for your reply.
> >
> > I guess I have to admit I get irritated at seeing some in this group do
> > their best to provoke, condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done
> > that.;) Is that irrational anger? I know it is irrational thinking to
think
> > that I can control what they say or how they react, BUT GOD, I WOULD
LIKE
> > TO! LOL
> >
> > Best,
> > Gail
> >
> Gail,
>
> I'm thinking that you *still* sometimes do what you've just said others do
:^))
>
> JB
>
>
>
I thought that is what I just said..;)
"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bn7slp$bj5$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vpep5i1e9uil71@corp.supernews.com...
> <snip>
> >
> > Thank you for your reply.
> >
> > I guess I have to admit I get irritated at seeing some in this group do
> > their best to provoke, condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done
> > that.;) Is that irrational anger? I know it is irrational thinking to
think
> > that I can control what they say or how they react, BUT GOD, I WOULD
LIKE
> > TO! LOL
> >
> > Best,
> > Gail
> >
> Gail,
>
> I'm thinking that you *still* sometimes do what you've just said others do
:^))
>
> JB
>
>
>
I think that is what I just said..;)
"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bn8cam$948$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vpep5i1e9uil71@corp.supernews.com...
> >
> IMO, if what someone says or how they behave is inconsistent with what I
understand to be reasonable
> or logical thinking/behaviour, I don't have to tell that person what I
think. If I chose to do so,
> these days, it's not often because I'm angry with them. FWIW, if someone
tells me that I am being
> irrational, I think about what they've said and if I find myself agreeing
with it, I have cause to
> thank them . By enabling me to see that I am not always right, such
people help me discover more
> about myself and in so doing enable me to make decisions about whether or
not I want to change
> myself in any way.
>
> Hope this makes sense.
>
> Yours
>
> JB
>
>
>
I found/find that to be easier said than done, at times. ;)
Best,
Gail
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:vpep5i1e9uil71@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Blue Moon" <mfoco@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:a66960b9104e37b986cffdfaed2ac15f@news.teranew s.com...
> > On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 15:35:39 -0500, "Gail"
> > <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
<snip
>
> I guess I have to admit I get irritated at seeing some in this group do
> their best to provoke, condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done
> that.;) Is that irrational anger?
<snip>
> Gail
>
Gail,
IMO, if what someone says or how they behave is inconsistent with what I understand to be reasonable
or logical thinking/behaviour, I don't have to tell that person what I think. If I chose to do so,
these days, it's not often because I'm angry with them. FWIW, if someone tells me that I am being
irrational, I think about what they've said and if I find myself agreeing with it, I have cause to
thank them . By enabling me to see that I am not always right, such people help me discover more
about myself and in so doing enable me to make decisions about whether or not I want to change
myself in any way.
Hope this makes sense.
Yours
JB
Robert McGregor
10-23-2003, 07:03 AM
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vpffitiq1ir3a9@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> news:bn8cam$948$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vpep5i1e9uil71@corp.supernews.com...
> > >
>
> > IMO, if what someone says or how they behave is inconsistent with what I
> understand to be reasonable
> > or logical thinking/behaviour, I don't have to tell that person what I
> think. If I chose to do so,
> > these days, it's not often because I'm angry with them. FWIW, if
someone
> tells me that I am being
> > irrational, I think about what they've said and if I find myself
agreeing
> with it, I have cause to
> > thank them . By enabling me to see that I am not always right, such
> people help me discover more
> > about myself and in so doing enable me to make decisions about whether
or
> not I want to change
> > myself in any way.
> >
> > Hope this makes sense.
> >
> > Yours
> >
> > JB
> >
> >
> >
>
> I found/find that to be easier said than done, at times. ;)
>
> Best,
> Gail
>
>
In my case, practice seldom if ever makes perfect. Nevertheless, practice is
a worthwhile pursuit, and often enlightening too.
Bob
Blue Moon
10-23-2003, 09:48 AM
On Thu, 23 Oct 2003 00:18:41 -0500, "Gail"
<serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I guess I have to admit I get irritated at seeing some in this group do
>their best to provoke, condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done
>that.;) Is that irrational anger? I know it is irrational thinking to think
>that I can control what they say or how they react, BUT GOD, I WOULD LIKE
>TO! LOL
Some people irritate me without angering me (if you can understand the
difference). That applies in this newsgroup (actually in most
newsgroups and online forums), in AA meetings, in working life, even
in home life.
All I can do is try to practice tolerance, and focus energy. However,
that doesn't necessitate acceptance of nonsense. I can be tolerant of
someone whilst still asking searching questions and/or not accepting
what is being said.
If they become intolerant of me in response, who is it who REALLY has
the problem?
--
Blue Moon
"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:bn8g2d$td9ak$1@ID-49289.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vpffitiq1ir3a9@corp.supernews.com...
> >
> > "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> > news:bn8cam$948$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > >
> > > "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:vpep5i1e9uil71@corp.supernews.com...
> > > >
> >
> > > IMO, if what someone says or how they behave is inconsistent with what I
> > understand to be reasonable
> > > or logical thinking/behaviour, I don't have to tell that person what I
> > think. If I chose to do so,
> > > these days, it's not often because I'm angry with them. FWIW, if
> someone
> > tells me that I am being
> > > irrational, I think about what they've said and if I find myself
> agreeing
> > with it, I have cause to
> > > thank them . By enabling me to see that I am not always right, such
> > people help me discover more
> > > about myself and in so doing enable me to make decisions about whether
> or
> > not I want to change
> > > myself in any way.
> > >
> > > Hope this makes sense.
> > >
> > > Yours
> > >
> > > JB
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > I found/find that to be easier said than done, at times. ;)
> >
> > Best,
> > Gail
> >
> >
>
> In my case, practice seldom if ever makes perfect. Nevertheless, practice is
> a worthwhile pursuit, and often enlightening too.
>
>
> Bob
>
At this point, I feel the need to say that I am trying to correct faults I know I have and that as
time goes by, I expect to discover more by myself and have others pointed out to me :^))
Yours
JB
Blue Moon
10-23-2003, 10:11 AM
On Thu, 23 Oct 2003 06:41:17 -0500, "Gail"
<serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I found/find that to be easier said than done, at times. ;)
I noticed that Step 7 offers no assurance that defects are actually
removed.
I decided that one of my defects was an excess of shyness. It really
becomes self-centred fear in a rather poor disguise. Some shyness is
perhaps okay, because to have none could simply bring out other
defects such as an excess of exuberance. But excessive shyness is not
okay when it's blocking me from what I want/need to be doing.
Good or bad, drunk or sober, alcoholics seem to get an excess of
everything! Except money, of course ;)
Whilst doing nothing but simply waiting for the shyness to disperse,
it seemed to simply magnify. I was then offered a suggestion from my
sponsor, and discovered an action that helped dissipate the symptom
.... go talk to someone. I didn't like that suggestion, because I
wanted to be rid of the shyness first. But it don't work that way.
Hence recovery from a defect is about taking actions that are contrary
to my old nature. For shyness, start talking. For greed, start
giving. For sloth, start working. And so on.
This also reinforces the sentence I feel is missing from the Big Book
..... no matter how religious someone might be or how much praying they
might do, "God won't do for us what we can do for ourselves".
The serenity prayer is also applicable, even without any dreaded G**
bit... I need "wisdom to know the difference" between what I can and
can't change. A big part of the fact-finding exercise of Step 4 is
learning what those defects are (although many defects were still
obscured at that time, the process itself seemed to open me up to
recognising them when they did emerge).
--
Blue Moon
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:vpffb8686p0203@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> news:bn7sfn$8je$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vpep5i1e9uil71@corp.supernews.com...
> > <snip>
> > > I guess I have to admit I get irritated at seeing some in this group do their best to provoke,
> > >condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done that.;)". Is that irrational anger? I
know it
> > >is irrational thinking to think that I can control what they say or how they react, BUT GOD, I
WOULD
> > >LIKE TO! LOL
> > >
> > > Best,
> > > Gail
JB wrote
> > Gail,
> >
> "I'm thinking that you *still* sometimes do what you've just said others do". :^))
> >
> > JB
Gail wrote:
> I thought that is what I just said..;)
Firstly, I apologise for posting my message twice.
Gail, having given further thought to your post, I think that it was unwise of me of say what I did.
When I read your statement " I guess I have to admit I get irritated at seeing some in this group do
their best to provoke, condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done that.;)", I immediately
thought about this post:
From: Gail (serenity6850_2000@nospamoyahoo.com)
Subject: Re: Ping Blackout
Newsgroups: alt.recovery.addiction.alcoholism
Date: 2003-09-05 21:59:47 PST
<snip>
I honestly think that JB is (J)ust (B)luffing us. JB has come farther
in two months than I did in 20 years. Something just AIN'T right here.
JB knows all the right buttons to push and the right do's and
don't's. Just a feeling I have had ever since JB started posting here.
Dunno bout this one. Gotta feeling we all know JB by another name?
Best,
Gail
When I realised that the evidence upon which my reply was based, did not prove the point I was
making, I was unable to do anything to stop it being posted.
Yours
JB .
Robert McGregor
10-23-2003, 03:15 PM
"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bn8o6g$ucj$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> At this point, I feel the need to say that I am trying to correct faults I
know I have and that as
> time goes by, I expect to discover more by myself and have others pointed
out to me :^))
>
> Yours
>
> JB
>
>
I believe that's exactly how it should be, prior to step seven.
Through steps four to seven, particularly at step six, I discovered
sufficient acceptance to acknowledge some of my negatives may never change,
and my aspirations to sainthood were replaced by a more pragmatic approach
to reality.
Some folk describe that condition as a primary attribute called humility.
Ps, I don't concur with those folk. Convinced that, for those of us who are
not saints, humility is merely a secondary attribute unattainable as a
direct goal, makes, humility, for me, a pointless persuit.
Bob
Shawster
10-23-2003, 08:36 PM
>
> Whilst doing nothing but simply waiting for the shyness to disperse,
> it seemed to simply magnify. I was then offered a suggestion from my
> sponsor, and discovered an action that helped dissipate the symptom
> ... go talk to someone. I didn't like that suggestion, because I
> wanted to be rid of the shyness first. But it don't work that way.
>
I am not going to say a thing.
"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bn8vgn$222$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vpffb8686p0203@corp.supernews.com...
> >
> > "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> > news:bn7sfn$8je$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > >
> > > "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:vpep5i1e9uil71@corp.supernews.com...
> > > <snip>
> > > > I guess I have to admit I get irritated at seeing some in this group
do their best to provoke,
> > > >condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done that.;)". Is
that irrational anger? I
> know it
> > > >is irrational thinking to think that I can control what they say or
how they react, BUT GOD, I
> WOULD
> > > >LIKE TO! LOL
> > > >
> > > > Best,
> > > > Gail
>
> JB wrote
> > > Gail,
> > >
> > "I'm thinking that you *still* sometimes do what you've just said others
do". :^))
> > >
> > > JB
>
> Gail wrote:
>
> > I thought that is what I just said..;)
>
> Firstly, I apologise for posting my message twice.
>
> Gail, having given further thought to your post, I think that it was
unwise of me of say what I did.
> When I read your statement " I guess I have to admit I get irritated at
seeing some in this group do
> their best to provoke, condemn, call people names, etc. Been there, done
that.;)", I immediately
> thought about this post:
>
> From: Gail (serenity6850_2000@nospamoyahoo.com)
> Subject: Re: Ping Blackout
> Newsgroups: alt.recovery.addiction.alcoholism
> Date: 2003-09-05 21:59:47 PST
>
> <snip>
> I honestly think that JB is (J)ust (B)luffing us. JB has come farther
> in two months than I did in 20 years. Something just AIN'T right here.
> JB knows all the right buttons to push and the right do's and
> don't's. Just a feeling I have had ever since JB started posting here.
> Dunno bout this one. Gotta feeling we all know JB by another name?
> Best,
> Gail
>
> When I realised that the evidence upon which my reply was based, did not
prove the point I was
> making, I was unable to do anything to stop it being posted.
>
> Yours
>
> JB .
>
>
JB, let it go. Holding on to old resentments is what kept me drunk for a
long long time, and please don't say you don't have a resentment about what
I post way back when. That is over and done with, in the past. I can't
change it, nor can you. I hope I was wrong. Feel better now?
To be honest, I don't Google, nor do I have any idea how to go back and look
at shit that all of us have posted at some time or other. No need to at all!
Might make me want to choose to drink, get mad or lash out at some of you or
even myself. I have said a whole lot of stupid things in the past two years
or so. I can also say that I have observed others in here who have been just
as silly and said some really dumb things at times, too. I remember a few
who use to write poetry and post it. LOL! Never made sense to me, but it
must have to those people. Some are still not drinking today. :)
Best,
Gail
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:vphcascvraaudf@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> news:bn8vgn$222$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vpffb8686p0203@corp.supernews.com...
<snip>
> JB, let it go. Holding on to old resentments is what kept me drunk for a
> long long time, and please don't say you don't have a resentment about what
> I post way back when. That is over and done with, in the past. I can't
> change it, nor can you. I hope I was wrong. Feel better now?
<snip>
Gail,
I shall say nothing about the way I feel today about what you wrote because my feelings today are
not relevant to my reasons for posting your remarks.
I note in your reply your comment "I hope I was wrong". That suggests to me that you might still
not believe that I am here because I am a genuine alcoholic who needs help not to drink again. In
the past, such a remark would have infuriated me and I would probably have posted a message that
would have left no-one in doubt that I was furious :^) Today, such remarks and also remarks that
appear to me to be unconcealed attempts to discredit me, cause me to smile. This change in me
proves to me that I can at times accept life as it is rather than how I wish it could be and
therefore it makes me happy ::^))
Best wishes
JB
Moonraker
10-24-2003, 08:06 AM
"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bnb26q$njr$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
> I shall say nothing about the way I feel today about what you wrote
because my feelings today are
> not relevant to my reasons for posting your remarks.
But, by saying "anything", you are, in effect, displaying your feelings.
> I note in your reply your comment "I hope I was wrong". That suggests to
me that you might still
> not believe that I am here because I am a genuine alcoholic who needs help
not to drink again.
Whatever Gail may think of your situation doesn't affect how YOU work your
program, does it? There's lots of folks who post on Usenet that, while
they are amusing to banter with, have nothing to offer me in the way of
growth in recovery. Gail, however, has posted many thoughtful comments
and, I believe, is genuine in her recovery. I've learned lots from her.
But, if I disagreed with her, it wouldn't send me off to the liquor store.
>Today, such remarks and also remarks that
> appear to me to be unconcealed attempts to discredit me, cause me to
smile.
I haven't seen anybody try to discredit you. (Except an occasional snide
comment from Rosie binBlabbin, and one would expect those. The only time
you should worry is if RRAP starts heaping praise on you. Then, you
probably are off track.) :>)
This change in me
> proves to me that I can at times accept life as it is
It's the duration of those intervals of acceptance that we all need to work
on, eh?
rather than how I wish it could be and
> therefore it makes me happy ::^))
>
> Best wishes
>
> JB
>
>
"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bnb26q$njr$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vphcascvraaudf@corp.supernews.com...
> >
> > "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> > news:bn8vgn$222$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > > "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:vpffb8686p0203@corp.supernews.com...
> <snip>
>
> > JB, let it go. Holding on to old resentments is what kept me drunk for a
> > long long time, and please don't say you don't have a resentment about
what
> > I post way back when. That is over and done with, in the past. I can't
> > change it, nor can you. I hope I was wrong. Feel better now?
>
> <snip>
>
> Gail,
>
> I shall say nothing about the way I feel today about what you wrote
because my feelings today are
> not relevant to my reasons for posting your remarks.
>
> I note in your reply your comment "I hope I was wrong". That suggests to
me that you might still
> not believe that I am here because I am a genuine alcoholic who needs help
not to drink again. In
> the past, such a remark would have infuriated me and I would probably have
posted a message that
> would have left no-one in doubt that I was furious :^) Today, such
remarks and also remarks that
> appear to me to be unconcealed attempts to discredit me, cause me to
smile. This change in me
> proves to me that I can at times accept life as it is rather than how I
wish it could be and
> therefore it makes me happy ::^))
>
> Best wishes
>
> JB
>
>
JB, how on earth do you know whether I am sincere or not? There are a lot of
good suggestions in this group and then there is a lot of bullshit.
Sometimes I have a time figuring out what is and what isn't bullshit. Can
you honestly say that you have not experienced that in this ng?
I said that I hope I was wrong about you. Only you know the answer to that.
This is Usenet?
Would you take my word on anything if I said, "Trust me"? ;)
Your above statement is your interpretation of what I said and did I not
read where you interpret that I am discrediting you? Why would you feel that
way? I do not believe that I have that much control over you or anyone else
in here unless you let me.
Take care,
Gail
Moonraker,
I can learn things from what you've said therefore many thanks for saying them. However, I'd like
you to know that I'm finding being introspective hard going. It is causing me to analyse everything
I say and do beforehand and also after getting a reaction. Doing the analyse causes me such worry
that I frequently get migraines. I do not think I am saying this because I feel self-pity. I think
I am saying it because I am wishing that there was an easier route to recovery. Leaving aside my
inability to always express myself clearly, I am wondering at this time whether I will ever again be
able to think that what I say is what I really believe to be the truth.
Regards
JB.
"Moonraker" <fuggadaboutit@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:Pj9mb.5618$Lj6.1408@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
>
> "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> news:bnb26q$njr$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > I shall say nothing about the way I feel today about what you wrote
> because my feelings today are
> > not relevant to my reasons for posting your remarks.
>
> But, by saying "anything", you are, in effect, displaying your feelings.
>
> > I note in your reply your comment "I hope I was wrong". That suggests to
> me that you might still
> > not believe that I am here because I am a genuine alcoholic who needs help
> not to drink again.
>
> Whatever Gail may think of your situation doesn't affect how YOU work your
> program, does it? There's lots of folks who post on Usenet that, while
> they are amusing to banter with, have nothing to offer me in the way of
> growth in recovery. Gail, however, has posted many thoughtful comments
> and, I believe, is genuine in her recovery. I've learned lots from her.
> But, if I disagreed with her, it wouldn't send me off to the liquor store.
>
> >Today, such remarks and also remarks that
> > appear to me to be unconcealed attempts to discredit me, cause me to
> smile.
>
> I haven't seen anybody try to discredit you. (Except an occasional snide
> comment from Rosie binBlabbin, and one would expect those. The only time
> you should worry is if RRAP starts heaping praise on you. Then, you
> probably are off track.) :>)
>
> This change in me
> > proves to me that I can at times accept life as it is
>
> It's the duration of those intervals of acceptance that we all need to work
> on, eh?
>
> rather than how I wish it could be and
> > therefore it makes me happy ::^))
> >
> > Best wishes
> >
> > JB
> >
"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:vpi94d43d0nq24@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> news:bnb26q$njr$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vphcascvraaudf@corp.supernews.com...
> > >
> > > "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> > > news:bn8vgn$222$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > > > "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > > news:vpffb8686p0203@corp.supernews.com...
> > <snip>
> >
> > > JB, let it go. Holding on to old resentments is what kept me drunk for a
> > > long long time, and please don't say you don't have a resentment about
> what
> > > I post way back when. That is over and done with, in the past. I can't
> > > change it, nor can you. I hope I was wrong. Feel better now?
> >
> > <snip>
> >
> > Gail,
> >
> > I shall say nothing about the way I feel today about what you wrote
> because my feelings today are
> > not relevant to my reasons for posting your remarks.
> >
> > I note in your reply your comment "I hope I was wrong". That suggests to
> me that you might still
> > not believe that I am here because I am a genuine alcoholic who needs help
> not to drink again. In
> > the past, such a remark would have infuriated me and I would probably have
> posted a message that
> > would have left no-one in doubt that I was furious :^) Today, such
> remarks and also remarks that
> > appear to me to be unconcealed attempts to discredit me, cause me to
> smile. This change in me
> > proves to me that I can at times accept life as it is rather than how I
> wish it could be and
> > therefore it makes me happy ::^))
> >
> > Best wishes
> >
> > JB
> >
> >
>
>
> JB, how on earth do you know whether I am sincere or not? There are a lot of
> good suggestions in this group and then there is a lot of bullshit.
> Sometimes I have a time figuring out what is and what isn't bullshit. Can
> you honestly say that you have not experienced that in this ng?
> I said that I hope I was wrong about you. Only you know the answer to that.
> This is Usenet?
> Would you take my word on anything if I said, "Trust me"? ;)
> Your above statement is your interpretation of what I said and did I not
> read where you interpret that I am discrediting you? Why would you feel that
> way? I do not believe that I have that much control over you or anyone else
> in here unless you let me.
> Take care,
> Gail
Gail,
At this time I have nothing more to say than I've read what you've said..
JB
Shawster
10-24-2003, 05:53 PM
When you have problems with introspection, just trust that God made you
exactly the way you are supposed to be.
God is cool, and makes good things.
"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bnbad3$iig$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> Moonraker,
>
> I can learn things from what you've said therefore many thanks for saying
them. However, I'd like
> you to know that I'm finding being introspective hard going. It is
causing me to analyse everything
> I say and do beforehand and also after getting a reaction. Doing the
analyse causes me such worry
> that I frequently get migraines. I do not think I am saying this because
I feel self-pity. I think
> I am saying it because I am wishing that there was an easier route to
recovery. Leaving aside my
> inability to always express myself clearly, I am wondering at this time
whether I will ever again be
> able to think that what I say is what I really believe to be the truth.
>
> Regards
>
> JB.
>
>
> "Moonraker" <fuggadaboutit@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> news:Pj9mb.5618$Lj6.1408@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
> >
> > "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> > news:bnb26q$njr$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > > I shall say nothing about the way I feel today about what you wrote
> > because my feelings today are
> > > not relevant to my reasons for posting your remarks.
> >
> > But, by saying "anything", you are, in effect, displaying your
feelings.
> >
> > > I note in your reply your comment "I hope I was wrong". That suggests
to
> > me that you might still
> > > not believe that I am here because I am a genuine alcoholic who needs
help
> > not to drink again.
> >
> > Whatever Gail may think of your situation doesn't affect how YOU work
your
> > program, does it? There's lots of folks who post on Usenet that, while
> > they are amusing to banter with, have nothing to offer me in the way of
> > growth in recovery. Gail, however, has posted many thoughtful comments
> > and, I believe, is genuine in her recovery. I've learned lots from
her.
> > But, if I disagreed with her, it wouldn't send me off to the liquor
store.
> >
> > >Today, such remarks and also remarks that
> > > appear to me to be unconcealed attempts to discredit me, cause me to
> > smile.
> >
> > I haven't seen anybody try to discredit you. (Except an occasional
snide
> > comment from Rosie binBlabbin, and one would expect those. The only
time
> > you should worry is if RRAP starts heaping praise on you. Then, you
> > probably are off track.) :>)
> >
> > This change in me
> > > proves to me that I can at times accept life as it is
> >
> > It's the duration of those intervals of acceptance that we all need to
work
> > on, eh?
> >
> > rather than how I wish it could be and
> > > therefore it makes me happy ::^))
> > >
> > > Best wishes
> > >
> > > JB
> > >
>
>
>
"Shawster" <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:v3imb.29676$Go5.538592@twister.tampabay.rr.co m...
> When you have problems with introspection, just trust that God made you
> exactly the way you are supposed to be.
>
> God is cool, and makes good things.
.............. which are not necessarily perfect :^)) LOL.
Thanks for cheering me up.
Best regards.
JB
>
>
>
> "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> news:bnbad3$iig$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > Moonraker,
> >
> > I can learn things from what you've said therefore many thanks for saying
> them. However, I'd like
> > you to know that I'm finding being introspective hard going.
Moonraker
10-24-2003, 07:02 PM
"JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:bnbad3$iig$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> Moonraker,
>
> I can learn things from what you've said therefore many thanks for saying
them. However, I'd like
> you to know that I'm finding being introspective hard going.
What you are (apparently) struggling over is seeking the results of the 9th
step promises (pg bottom of 83-and top of pg 84). Give it time. They
(the promises) are being fulfilled among us, sometimes quickly, sometimes
slowly. They WILL materialize.....
>It is causing me to analyse everything
> I say and do beforehand and also after getting a reaction. Doing the
analyse causes me such worry
> that I frequently get migraines. I do not think I am saying this because
I feel self-pity. I think
> I am saying it because I am wishing that there was an easier route to
recovery.
Still looking for that easier, softer, way, eh? ;>)
>Leaving aside my
> inability to always express myself clearly, I am wondering at this time
whether I will ever again be
> able to think that what I say is what I really believe to be the truth.
Methinks you worry too much.
>
> Regards
>
> JB.
>
>
> "Moonraker" <fuggadaboutit@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> news:Pj9mb.5618$Lj6.1408@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
> >
> > "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> > news:bnb26q$njr$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > > I shall say nothing about the way I feel today about what you wrote
> > because my feelings today are
> > > not relevant to my reasons for posting your remarks.
> >
> > But, by saying "anything", you are, in effect, displaying your
feelings.
> >
> > > I note in your reply your comment "I hope I was wrong". That suggests
to
> > me that you might still
> > > not believe that I am here because I am a genuine alcoholic who needs
help
> > not to drink again.
> >
> > Whatever Gail may think of your situation doesn't affect how YOU work
your
> > program, does it? There's lots of folks who post on Usenet that, while
> > they are amusing to banter with, have nothing to offer me in the way of
> > growth in recovery. Gail, however, has posted many thoughtful comments
> > and, I believe, is genuine in her recovery. I've learned lots from
her.
> > But, if I disagreed with her, it wouldn't send me off to the liquor
store.
> >
> > >Today, such remarks and also remarks that
> > > appear to me to be unconcealed attempts to discredit me, cause me to
> > smile.
> >
> > I haven't seen anybody try to discredit you. (Except an occasional
snide
> > comment from Rosie binBlabbin, and one would expect those. The only
time
> > you should worry is if RRAP starts heaping praise on you. Then, you
> > probably are off track.) :>)
> >
> > This change in me
> > > proves to me that I can at times accept life as it is
> >
> > It's the duration of those intervals of acceptance that we all need to
work
> > on, eh?
> >
> > rather than how I wish it could be and
> > > therefore it makes me happy ::^))
> > >
> > > Best wishes
> > >
> > > JB
> > >
>
>
And God gave us FREEWILL. ;)
"Shawster" <shawster@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:v3imb.29676$Go5.538592@twister.tampabay.rr.co m...
> When you have problems with introspection, just trust that God made you
> exactly the way you are supposed to be.
>
> God is cool, and makes good things.
>
>
>
>
> "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> news:bnbad3$iig$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > Moonraker,
> >
> > I can learn things from what you've said therefore many thanks for
saying
> them. However, I'd like
> > you to know that I'm finding being introspective hard going. It is
> causing me to analyse everything
> > I say and do beforehand and also after getting a reaction. Doing the
> analyse causes me such worry
> > that I frequently get migraines. I do not think I am saying this
because
> I feel self-pity. I think
> > I am saying it because I am wishing that there was an easier route to
> recovery. Leaving aside my
> > inability to always express myself clearly, I am wondering at this time
> whether I will ever again be
> > able to think that what I say is what I really believe to be the truth.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > JB.
> >
> >
> > "Moonraker" <fuggadaboutit@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> > news:Pj9mb.5618$Lj6.1408@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
> > >
> > > "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
> > > news:bnb26q$njr$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > > > I shall say nothing about the way I feel today about what you wrote
> > > because my feelings today are
> > > > not relevant to my reasons for posting your remarks.
> > >
> > > But, by saying "anything", you are, in effect, displaying your
> feelings.
> > >
> > > > I note in your reply your comment "I hope I was wrong". That
suggests
> to
> > > me that you might still
> > > > not believe that I am here because I am a genuine alcoholic who
needs
> help
> > > not to drink again.
> > >
> > > Whatever Gail may think of your situation doesn't affect how YOU work
> your
> > > program, does it? There's lots of folks who post on Usenet that,
while
> > > they are amusing to banter with, have nothing to offer me in the way
of
> > > growth in recovery. Gail, however, has posted many thoughtful
comments
> > > and, I believe, is genuine in her recovery. I've learned lots from
> her.
> > > But, if I disagreed with her, it wouldn't send me off to the liquor
> store.
> > >
> > > >Today, such remarks and also remarks that
> > > > appear to me to be unconcealed attempts to discredit me, cause me to
> > > smile.
> > >
> > > I haven't seen anybody try to discredit you. (Except an occasional
> snide
> > > comment from Rosie binBlabbin, and one would expect those. The only
> time
> > > you should worry is if RRAP starts heaping praise on you. Then, you
> > > probably are off track.) :>)
> > >
> > > This change in me
> > > > proves to me that I can at times accept life as it is
> > >
> > > It's the duration of those intervals of acceptance that we all need to
> work
> > > on, eh?
> > >
> > > rather than how I wish it could be and
> > > > therefore it makes me happy ::^))
> > > >
> > > > Best wishes
> > > >
> > > > JB
> > > >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Blue Moon
10-24-2003, 08:15 PM
On Fri, 24 Oct 2003 15:30:27 +0100, "JB" <JBCatRB@coldman.com> wrote:
>I can learn things from what you've said therefore many thanks for saying them. However, I'd like
>you to know that I'm finding being introspective hard going. It is causing me to analyse everything
>I say and do beforehand and also after getting a reaction. Doing the analyse causes me such worry
>that I frequently get migraines. I do not think I am saying this because I feel self-pity. I think
>I am saying it because I am wishing that there was an easier route to recovery. Leaving aside my
>inability to always express myself clearly, I am wondering at this time whether I will ever again be
>able to think that what I say is what I really believe to be the truth.
I used to beat myself up for not being better than I really was. I
found it useful to reflect not on where I thought I should be, but on
where I had come from (physically/emotionally/spiritually). I could
then see the progress I had made.
--
Blue Moon
Jonathan Bratt
10-26-2003, 05:52 AM
In message <v3imb.29676$Go5.538592@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, Shawster
<shawster@tampabay.rr.com> writes
>When you have problems with introspection, just trust that God made you
>exactly the way you are supposed to be.
>
>God is cool, and makes good things.
Like Ebola? >-)
--
Jonathan Bratt
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