Alternatives to 12 step non treatment

[Detlef Sax]

Hi my name is Detlef,
in past Markus posted more or less periodically a list of alternatives
to 12 step treatment. Now this job is vacant. As long as no one else
posts this list, I will keep on posting.

Here are only the addresses:

http://www.moderation.org/
http://www.rational.org/
http://www.secularhumanism.org/sos/
http://www.unhooked.com/index.htm
http://www.smartrecovery.org/
http://www.womenforsobriety.org/

An article to the topic:
http://kurzdsx.de/?u=1d

Regards
Detlef

--
http://noart.de
http://12schrittefrei.de/

[Craig S.]

"Detlef Sax" <sax@noart.de> wrote in message
news:slrnbmchdr.2aa.sax@zottel2.noart.de...
> Hi my name is Detlef,
> in past Markus posted more or less periodically a list of alternatives
> to 12 step treatment. Now this job is vacant. As long as no one else
> posts this list, I will keep on posting.

http://www.soberforever.net/

Detlef, here is another non 12-step resource to add to your list. This is
the real deal. Heck, testimonials and everything.

[Ted]

This method, used at the Health Recovery Center, sounds extremely promising,
claiming a 75% success rate. Does anyone here have first-hand experience
with this approach? My brother may choose rehab soon, and I'm trying to
find an approach that is most likely to succeed. We are in St. Louis,

thanks,

ted



"Detlef Sax" <sax@noart.de> wrote in message
news:slrnbmchdr.2aa.sax@zottel2.noart.de...
> Hi my name is Detlef,
> in past Markus posted more or less periodically a list of alternatives
> to 12 step treatment. Now this job is vacant. As long as no one else
> posts this list, I will keep on posting.
>
> Here are only the addresses:
>
> http://www.moderation.org/
> http://www.rational.org/
> http://www.secularhumanism.org/sos/
> http://www.unhooked.com/index.htm
> http://www.smartrecovery.org/
> http://www.womenforsobriety.org/
>
> An article to the topic:
> http://kurzdsx.de/?u=1d
>
> Regards
> Detlef
>
> --
> http://noart.de
> http://12schrittefrei.de/

[Craig S.]

"Ted" <TEDRIKA@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
news:vmsp1vn4vv3c0f@corp.supernews.com...

> My brother may choose rehab soon, and I'm trying to
> find an approach that is most likely to succeed. We are in St. Louis,

http://www.doc.missouri.gov/overview.htm

[Blue Moon]

On Sun, 21 Sep 2003 22:01:05 -0500, "Ted" <TEDRIKA@peoplepc.com>
wrote:

>This method, used at the Health Recovery Center, sounds extremely promising,
>claiming a 75% success rate.

That's the exact same figure quoted in "Alcoholics Anonymous" (before
"AA recovery" got distorted by treatment centres, the 12x12, etc.)

> Does anyone here have first-hand experience
>with this approach? My brother may choose rehab soon, and I'm trying to
>find an approach that is most likely to succeed.

There's a direct correlation between "success" and "willingness".

--
Blue Moon

[Agent_Orange]

"Ted" <TEDRIKA@peoplepc.com> wrote in message news:<vmsp1vn4vv3c0f@corp.supernews.com>...
> This method, used at the Health Recovery Center, sounds extremely promising,
> claiming a 75% success rate. Does anyone here have first-hand experience
> with this approach? My brother may choose rehab soon, and I'm trying to
> find an approach that is most likely to succeed. We are in St. Louis,
>
> thanks,
>
> ted
>
They cook the books. They engage in Enron-style accounting.
They only report what percentage of the program *graduates*
stay clean and sober. They hide all of their failures "off
of the books" just like how Enron hid all of its expenses
and losses someplace else, leaving only illusory billions
in profits for everyone to see.

So if 100 people go into the program, and 90 flunk out,
drop out, drink and dope out, whatever, leaving 10, and
3 months later 7 or 8 of them are still sober, then they
report a 70 or 80% success rate.

Obviously, the real success rate is one tenth of what they
are reporting. It is really 7% or 8%.

And then they also fail to do long-term follow-ups. How many
of those seven or eight are still clean and sober at the
one year point? They don't even want to know that number.
And they sure as heck don't want you to know it.

And that outregeous unethical behavior really is the industry
standard.

See:
http://aorange1.tripod.com/orange-effectiveness.html

* Agent Orange *
* agent_orange@linuxmail.org *
* AA and Recovery Cult Debunking *
* http://aorange1.tripod.com/ *
** Being surrounded by a group of people who keep telling
** you that you are powerless over alcohol, and that your
** will power is useless, is not getting "support". It is
** getting sabotaged.
** With friends like them, you don't need any enemies.

[Agent_Orange]

"Ted" <TEDRIKA@peoplepc.com> wrote in message news:<vmsp1vn4vv3c0f@corp.supernews.com>...
> This method, used at the Health Recovery Center, sounds extremely promising,
> claiming a 75% success rate. Does anyone here have first-hand experience
> with this approach? My brother may choose rehab soon, and I'm trying to
> find an approach that is most likely to succeed. We are in St. Louis,
>
> thanks,
>
> ted
>
Hi. Unfortunately, they cook the books. They engage in Enron-style
accounting. They only reveal what percentage of the program
*graduates* stay clean and sober for a while.
They discount and hide all of their failures, drop-outs
and relapsers. Enron created the illusion of big profits by
hiding all of their expenses and losses someplace else, "off
of the books", and the treatment facilities do the same thing.

How it works is, imagine that 100 people enter a program.
Before it's over, 90 of them drop out, leave, drink and dope
their way out, get kicked out, whatever. That leaves 10 to
graduate. If, a month or two later, 7 or 8 of them are still
on the wagon, then the treatment facility brags about a
70 or 80 percent success rate.

Obviously, the real success rate is 7 or 8 percent.

And they rarely or never do long-term follow-ups. How many of
their graduates are still clean and sober one year later?
They don't even want to know that number, and they sure as
heck don't want you to know it.

This unethical, fraudulent behavior is actually the norm, the
industry standard.

See:
http://aorange1.tripod.com/orange-effectiveness.html

Also see a letter I just got from a woman who put her boyfriend
through *seven* rehab programs. It is towards the end of this
file:
http://aorange1.tripod.com/orange-letters11.html

* Agent Orange *
* agent_orange@linuxmail.org *
* AA and Recovery Cult Debunking *
* http://aorange1.tripod.com/ *
** Being surrounded by a group of people who keep telling
** you that you are powerless over alcohol, and that your
** will power is useless, is not getting "support". It is
** getting sabotaged.
** With friends like them, you don't need any enemies.