Struggling with my belief system

[Gail]

I wanted to post and hopefully get feedback. I am really struggling, in
fact, obsessed with what I do and do not believe in. I am not
struggling with my past and what was done to me or what I did to
anyone, and I am not wanting to drink. What I am struggling with is my
belief system. I know that there is a God. Professing that I am a
Christian and wanting to believe that Jesus died on the cross and
feeling guilty that I have doubts is what I am obsessing over. I am
trying so hard to be what I think God wants me to be and am always
second guessing myself after I do something that I think is good. I
start obsessing on whether I did it without expecting anything in
return and then I always think that if is selfish of me because I will
get something out of it, even if only a blessing from God. Can I really
do anthing without not expecting something in return, even if it is
from God. All this stuff is just going around and around and around in
my head constantly.

Then, there are the religious types that I do not want to be like. The
other day during one of the groups that I facilitate, I said the f
word. Well, after the group this man that profess's his love for Jesus
Christ stayed after the meeting and gave me a sermon on watching how I
talk. I had apologized immediately after I said it and said that I hope
I didn't offend anyone. He proceeded to stay and talk for 45 minutes
and then wanted to pray for me and my family. I let him, and God knows
me and my family need prayers, but I felt like he was looking down on
me and I don't want to be that kind of Christian. He could have left
and prayed for me and my family and accepted me for being human. Am I
wrong to feel that way? I should just accept him and pray for him.
After reading that previous sentences I realized I was expecting him to
do something I should be doing. (Chuckle for the day on me)

Anyway, my husband and I are starting a different recovery group this
Friday. It is a Christ centered recovery program in a church near us. I
have some friends who have been long time AA'ers and are involved with
programs like this in their church. I am looking forward to starting
it.

Any feedback from you all will be appreciated.

And Rosie, before you ask or tell me to go, no I haven't been to AA and
no I don't have a sponsor. I have e-mailed back and forth with my
girlfriend who is in recovery.

Best to all,
Gail

[Dan McGown]

"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1131558487.854029.6940@g47g2000cwa.googlegrou ps.com...
>I wanted to post and hopefully get feedback. I am really struggling,

Geez, Hon, welcome to the wonderful world of mortality. <grin> This one is
with all of us, always. As the father of the sick child said in Mark
9:24 -- "Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief."
Now, according to the story in Mark, Jesus didn't think that was stupid
but instead he thought that was a legitimate thing to say and did as he was
asked.
My point is not whether Christian theology is right but rather that
even in strict Christian theology there is room for personal doubts. My
dear, we all have doubts about things large and small. I'm pretty sure that
if there is a God who made people that he knows that.
As to AA meetings -- or theology, for that matter -- do what helps you
and gives you strength and let the rest go. If meeting and sponsors could
work for you then use them but if they don't then find what does. Since you
are a Christian, keep in mind that Jesus said to judge trees and wells by
their output.
Once in my youth, out of sophomoric smart-assedness, we thought we were
putting a trap on our Episcopal priest. We pointed out a girl who was an
exchange student from Egypt and a Muslim. We said that she was a really
nice person who tried to do right things but that she wasn't a Christian and
asked him if she was going to hell. Father Ben said, "Let me tell you how
big my God is. He's so big that if he wanted to talk to different people
different ways that he would do so -- and he wouldn't even ask my
permission."
I don't think that there is necessarily one path to sobriety either.
Do what works.
Dan

[Gail]

"Dan McGown" <dmcgown@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:S4OdnUa2g-wg0O_eRVn-uA@adelphia.com...
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1131558487.854029.6940@g47g2000cwa.googlegrou ps.com...
>>I wanted to post and hopefully get feedback. I am really struggling,
>
> Geez, Hon, welcome to the wonderful world of mortality. <grin> This one
> is with all of us, always. As the father of the sick child said in Mark
> 9:24 -- "Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief."
> Now, according to the story in Mark, Jesus didn't think that was
> stupid but instead he thought that was a legitimate thing to say and did
> as he was asked.
> My point is not whether Christian theology is right but rather that
> even in strict Christian theology there is room for personal doubts. My
> dear, we all have doubts about things large and small. I'm pretty sure
> that if there is a God who made people that he knows that.
> As to AA meetings -- or theology, for that matter -- do what helps you
> and gives you strength and let the rest go. If meeting and sponsors could
> work for you then use them but if they don't then find what does. Since
> you are a Christian, keep in mind that Jesus said to judge trees and wells
> by their output.
> Once in my youth, out of sophomoric smart-assedness, we thought we
> were putting a trap on our Episcopal priest. We pointed out a girl who
> was an exchange student from Egypt and a Muslim. We said that she was a
> really nice person who tried to do right things but that she wasn't a
> Christian and asked him if she was going to hell. Father Ben said, "Let
> me tell you how big my God is. He's so big that if he wanted to talk to
> different people different ways that he would do so -- and he wouldn't
> even ask my permission."
> I don't think that there is necessarily one path to sobriety either.
> Do what works.
> Dan
>

Thank you, Dan. This recovery program at the church is based on the 12 steps
and does have people in it that sponsor. It is called "Celebrate Recovery".
On their web site it appeals to me what they offer. I think the way I feel
towards AA is because of what my beliefs are and that is another thing that
I struggle with. I lurk and read some in another ng and I read where someone
said that they didn't feel free to talk about or ask the questions about
Jesus in an AA meeting. At first, when I started going to AA I didn't want
to hear about God, Jesus or HP. I used to get so pissed if someone brought
him up. I understand why it seems sortof forbidden in AA to talk about Him.
I am hoping that I can ask questions, like I have asked here, in this new
group I am going to go to. I hope I find a sponsor in this group that lives
close by. I want those things and have fought it for so long. I struggle
with the guilt of not doing what people in AA have suggested I do. I think
if you could do it, why can't I. I realized after I post that I know I don't
do enough to find my answers. I want some one else to give them to me and
that won't work. I read in my bible and understand it more now. I struggle
with guilt if I think I didn't read long enough. I know I don't apply myself
like I should. I might find my answers when I really start applying myself
more. I don't know if I am making any sense at all. I never had much of an
ability to put my thoughts into words. That is one reason I like reading
what all of you post. You all always make so much sense and it is almost
always what I needed to read.
Thanks again. Love ya!
Gail

[rosie read n' post]

"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
....................
> And Rosie, before you ask or tell me to go, no I haven't been to AA
and
> no I don't have a sponsor. I have e-mailed back and forth with my
> girlfriend who is in recovery.
>
> Best to all,
> Gail
>

gail,
i wish you best in any direction you take that will reinforce your
recovery from addiction.

rosie

[Been There Got A Mug]

Damn't Jim I'm only a micro brain surgeon, not belief therapist !
Can't your read the sign on the door ? I can't fix on HER
with these privitive tools I have !

Good luck Gail ! ;-)

[stuart]

Dan McGown <dmcgown@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:S4OdnUa2g-wg0O_eRVn-uA@adelphia.com...
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1131558487.854029.6940@g47g2000cwa.googlegrou ps.com...
> >I wanted to post and hopefully get feedback. I am really struggling,
>
> Geez, Hon, welcome to the wonderful world of mortality. <grin> This one
is
> with all of us, always. As the father of the sick child said in Mark
> 9:24 -- "Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief."
> Now, according to the story in Mark, Jesus didn't think that was
stupid
> but instead he thought that was a legitimate thing to say and did as he
was
> asked.
> My point is not whether Christian theology is right but rather that
> even in strict Christian theology there is room for personal doubts. My
> dear, we all have doubts about things large and small. I'm pretty sure
that
> if there is a God who made people that he knows that.
> As to AA meetings -- or theology, for that matter -- do what helps
you
> and gives you strength and let the rest go. If meeting and sponsors could
> work for you then use them but if they don't then find what does. Since
you
> are a Christian, keep in mind that Jesus said to judge trees and wells by
> their output.
> Once in my youth, out of sophomoric smart-assedness, we thought we
were
> putting a trap on our Episcopal priest. We pointed out a girl who was an
> exchange student from Egypt and a Muslim. We said that she was a really
> nice person who tried to do right things but that she wasn't a Christian
and
> asked him if she was going to hell. Father Ben said, "Let me tell you how
> big my God is. He's so big that if he wanted to talk to different people
> different ways that he would do so -- and he wouldn't even ask my
> permission."
> I don't think that there is necessarily one path to sobriety either.
> Do what works.
> Dan

Right on Dan, especially the quip from Father Ben...

[Lost in Space]

>Father Ben said, "Let me tell you how
>big my God is. He's so big that if he wanted to talk to different people
>different ways that he would do so -- and he wouldn't even ask my permission."
>

Ben sounds like my type of guy. He knows where his place in the line
is for
giving advice.

[WACO]

Be careful, many would rather be around a consummate drunk than a born again.

Gail wrote:

> I wanted to post and hopefully get feedback. I am really struggling, in
> fact, obsessed with what I do and do not believe in. I am not
> struggling with my past and what was done to me or what I did to
> anyone, and I am not wanting to drink. What I am struggling with is my
> belief system. I know that there is a God. Professing that I am a
> Christian and wanting to believe that Jesus died on the cross and
> feeling guilty that I have doubts is what I am obsessing over. I am
> trying so hard to be what I think God wants me to be and am always
> second guessing myself after I do something that I think is good. I
> start obsessing on whether I did it without expecting anything in
> return and then I always think that if is selfish of me because I will
> get something out of it, even if only a blessing from God. Can I really
> do anthing without not expecting something in return, even if it is
> from God. All this stuff is just going around and around and around in
> my head constantly.
>
> Then, there are the religious types that I do not want to be like. The
> other day during one of the groups that I facilitate, I said the f
> word. Well, after the group this man that profess's his love for Jesus
> Christ stayed after the meeting and gave me a sermon on watching how I
> talk. I had apologized immediately after I said it and said that I hope
> I didn't offend anyone. He proceeded to stay and talk for 45 minutes
> and then wanted to pray for me and my family. I let him, and God knows
> me and my family need prayers, but I felt like he was looking down on
> me and I don't want to be that kind of Christian. He could have left
> and prayed for me and my family and accepted me for being human. Am I
> wrong to feel that way? I should just accept him and pray for him.
> After reading that previous sentences I realized I was expecting him to
> do something I should be doing. (Chuckle for the day on me)
>
> Anyway, my husband and I are starting a different recovery group this
> Friday. It is a Christ centered recovery program in a church near us. I
> have some friends who have been long time AA'ers and are involved with
> programs like this in their church. I am looking forward to starting
> it.
>
> Any feedback from you all will be appreciated.
>
> And Rosie, before you ask or tell me to go, no I haven't been to AA and
> no I don't have a sponsor. I have e-mailed back and forth with my
> girlfriend who is in recovery.
>
> Best to all,
> Gail
>

[Lost in Space]

Hi Gail,
Sounds like your looking more for group therapy help
from friend(s) than one based on AA topic where
cross talk is limited to none, and one person has the floor
to express how the/he overcame his chemical of no choice.

Those group babble fests usually ends up as yelling matches
and thus why I think AA/12 steps kept with a outline to follow.
I'm not trying to be mean, but believe it or not sometimes there
are just too many consultants and too few listeners at some of these
meetings. Crankly old timers and new comers wanting to do it their
new own way in a hurry.

You don't even seem to understand your own innerself, so how can a
bunch of
strangers help ? You know what jumps out at me in your writings ?

I want
I fought
I need
I feel guilt

Analyze that ...

Peace.

[stuart]

Lost in Space <gwbdopesmoker@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1131590958.816369.296480@g14g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>
> Hi Gail,
> Sounds like your looking more for group therapy help
> from friend(s) than one based on AA topic where
> cross talk is limited to none, and one person has the floor
> to express how the/he overcame his chemical of no choice.
>
> Those group babble fests usually ends up as yelling matches
> and thus why I think AA/12 steps kept with a outline to follow.
> I'm not trying to be mean, but believe it or not sometimes there
> are just too many consultants and too few listeners at some of these
> meetings. Crankly old timers and new comers wanting to do it their
> new own way in a hurry.
>
> You don't even seem to understand your own innerself, so how can a
> bunch of
> strangers help ? You know what jumps out at me in your writings ?
>
> I want
> I fought
> I need
> I feel guilt
>
> Analyze that ...
>
> Peace.

We addicts in recovery use the "I" word a lot in our musings as a general
rule, myself included. It does reveal something about the writer to a reader
sometimes.

[Dudley Do Rite]

Impressive, Dan - thanks for sharing.

Gail, I'm Christian (born and raised) and constantly had doubts about my
motivations, God's role in my life, my role in God's universe, how miracles
really happened, how would I know God's will for me... etc etc etc ad
nauseum. I got a daily devotional book a few years ago and try hard to read
it and think on it every day. Occassionally, the message(s) contained
something that resonated. Then as I kept at it, the messages resonated with
more and more frequency. I'd like to say that now, every message hits me
somehow. That'd be a lie but I do "hear" what I'm supposed to hear so
often, that I now stop questioning why. The more conscious I am of the
inexplicable - especially "coincidences" - the more my faith in God, Jesus
and the Holy Spirit is affirmed.

I'm 40 years old. My faith has only gotten stronger in the last 3 or 4
years. It's gotten much stronger during my "almost 6 months" (!) of
sobriety. My faith rocketed after spending a week helping the relief effort
in New Orleans 2 weeks ago. Keep at it. Keep testing it. "Relax and take
it easy." (pg 86)

It'll come for you, and it won;t be on your timetable. It'll be on God's.
He'll know when you're ready.

Thanks again Dan - I'm thankful for the very well thought out words and the
spirit behind them.

steve

"Dan McGown" <dmcgown@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:S4OdnUa2g-wg0O_eRVn-uA@adelphia.com...
>
> "Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1131558487.854029.6940@g47g2000cwa.googlegrou ps.com...
>>I wanted to post and hopefully get feedback. I am really struggling,
>
> Geez, Hon, welcome to the wonderful world of mortality. <grin> This one
> is with all of us, always. As the father of the sick child said in Mark
> 9:24 -- "Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief."
> Now, according to the story in Mark, Jesus didn't think that was
> stupid but instead he thought that was a legitimate thing to say and did
> as he was asked.
> My point is not whether Christian theology is right but rather that
> even in strict Christian theology there is room for personal doubts. My
> dear, we all have doubts about things large and small. I'm pretty sure
> that if there is a God who made people that he knows that.
> As to AA meetings -- or theology, for that matter -- do what helps you
> and gives you strength and let the rest go. If meeting and sponsors could
> work for you then use them but if they don't then find what does. Since
> you are a Christian, keep in mind that Jesus said to judge trees and wells
> by their output.
> Once in my youth, out of sophomoric smart-assedness, we thought we
> were putting a trap on our Episcopal priest. We pointed out a girl who
> was an exchange student from Egypt and a Muslim. We said that she was a
> really nice person who tried to do right things but that she wasn't a
> Christian and asked him if she was going to hell. Father Ben said, "Let
> me tell you how big my God is. He's so big that if he wanted to talk to
> different people different ways that he would do so -- and he wouldn't
> even ask my permission."
> I don't think that there is necessarily one path to sobriety either.
> Do what works.
> Dan
>

[Ricky Gentry]

> I wanted to post and hopefully get feedback.

I hope you don't mind then. I'll share some of my growth experiences.
First, I have always been a good church member and a Christian since I was
11 (now 46). Still, drinking nailed me.


I am really struggling, in
> fact, obsessed with what I do and do not believe in. I am not
> struggling with my past and what was done to me or what I did to
> anyone, and I am not wanting to drink. What I am struggling with is my
> belief system.

That can be a good thing. It was growth for me to question. Alcoholism was
God's way of getting my attention.

I know that there is a God. Professing that I am a
> Christian and wanting to believe that Jesus died on the cross and
> feeling guilty that I have doubts is what I am obsessing over.

Don't let guilt be the deciding factor. To be honest, during step work (on
2 & 3) a lot of that questioning went away. I really had to take God's and
Jesus' promises for fact (They said it, that settles it.)

I'll use the AA axiom- read the literature, pray in the morning and at
night, talk to someone about their experiences.


I am
> trying so hard to be what I think God wants me to be

LOL- I hear my voice in that. God don't "want you" to be anything but you.
That is hard for me to accept too.

and am always
> second guessing myself after I do something that I think is good. I
> start obsessing on whether I did it without expecting anything in
> return and then I always think that if is selfish of me because I will
> get something out of it, even if only a blessing from God. Can I really
> do anthing without not expecting something in return, even if it is
> from God. All this stuff is just going around and around and around in
> my head constantly.

That is a large question. No one has the answer (at least human). We are
all motivated, consciously or uncouscously, by the reward we get from
something- even just the feeling that we did something 'good'.

The humbleness of step 7 really helped me. Steps 4&5 set the stage for it
too. Having to come to God in broken humbleness (with absolutely no
expectation of return, not knowing what would happen, if anything) helped to
show me how BIG God is. He is above my concept to "understand".

AA says to "do the next right thing". Even without expectation of reward.
Only practice helps with that one.

>
> Then, there are the religious types that I do not want to be like. The
> other day during one of the groups that I facilitate, I said the f
> word.

Granted there are many 'types' that I do not want to emulate. However, if
this was a 'church' group- then, yes, it was not advised to use that word.
I would put it to the same litmus test you used above. Were you saying it
for a reaction (shock) or to emphasize the pain? Did you say it to get a
reaction? Or was it just a slip of the tongue? PS- No need to answer, I
just said that as a need for you to examine the motives.

Granted, the 'holier than thou' reaction from the other fellow is a turn
off.

But, if you were the facilitator, the reaction should have been anticipated.

> Anyway, my husband and I are starting a different recovery group this
> Friday. It is a Christ centered recovery program in a church near us. I
> have some friends who have been long time AA'ers and are involved with
> programs like this in their church. I am looking forward to starting
> it.
>
no I haven't been to AA and
> no I don't have a sponsor. I have e-mailed back and forth with my
> girlfriend who is in recovery.

To be honest, if you are struggling with your belief system, should you be
starting a recovery group (especially since you yourself have not been to
AA- if not even for research)? I think that being part of a goup like
Celebrate Recovery and AA will help in that search. Being a "leader" of
either one without having been a member puts a lot of pressure on you. Just
a thought.

Celebrate Recovery has not been too effective in my area because the people
involved cannot focus on their problems. AA deals and talks about alcohol,
NA concentrates on drugs, etc... Celebrate Recovery has smokers,
overeaters, nail biters, etc... Plus, it usually meets in a church and is
promoted by a congregation- there is always that stigma giving well meaning
gossips ammunition. That's just what I have seen in this area. It may be
different in other parts of the country.

The main thing- do whatever keeps you from drinking + gets you some
spiritual growth.

RG

[Robert McGregor]

"stuart" <fred@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:Rezcf.118693$yS6.55751@clgrps12...
>
> We addicts in recovery use the "I" word a lot in our musings as a
> general
> rule, myself included. It does reveal something about the writer to
> a reader
> sometimes.
>

Other than in a case of demonic possession, or multiple
personalities, can anyone here imagine a situation where one could
write of oneself, at length, *without* monotonous repetition of the
proverbial "I"

The irony surrounding Stuart is to whom amongst his multiple
personalities any individual "I" pertains. http://tinyurl.com/asdly

Bob

[Sardonicus Rex]

Hey, Gail!

I don't want to sound cavalier by saying so -- and am not speaking for
anybody but myself -- but I believe that everyone with ANY belief system at
all has doubts from time to time about a lot of stuff. Even insomniac
agnostic dyslexics lie awake at night and wonder if there is a Dog.

God knew we'd have doubts when He gave us free will. I highly doubt he's
surprised when we have them. I sure as heck hope not, anyway.

S.R.

[Gail]

You all know me so well. Thank you all for your replies. You all have to be
angels!
Gail

[Sheenah]

"Gail" <serenity6850_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1131558487.854029.6940@g47g2000cwa.googlegrou ps.com...
> I wanted to post and hopefully get feedback. I am really struggling,
in
> fact, obsessed with what I do and do not believe in. I am not
> struggling with my past and what was done to me or what I did to
> anyone, and I am not wanting to drink. What I am struggling with is my
> belief system. I know that there is a God. Professing that I am a
> Christian and wanting to believe that Jesus died on the cross and
> feeling guilty that I have doubts is what I am obsessing over.

Gail,

FWIW, when just a child I was told by my Sunday School teacher, that if
I did not live a good life, when Jesus came again - which was, according
to this woman, going to be in my lifetime but not her's - I'd not be
saved. So for a time I tried to live what I thought God's view of a
"good life" was. Bcause I often felt myself unable to meet what I
thought his view was, I got mentally screwed up, very unhappy and
thought life unbearable.

Over the years the I have tried also to live up to what I have either
thought other people's expectations of me have been, what people have
tried to get me to do and also my own expectations/standards. Again,
when my mind has let me believe that I have not lived up to these
expectations, often I have become mentally screwed up, very unhappy and
thought life unbearable.

I have come to believe that only when I have on my "sensible" head can I
easily accept the suggestion that I not let thoughts about me being in
either my eyes and sometimes other people's eyes not perfect , screw me
up. With that same head on, I can easily accept that despite all my
imperfections and character defects, some people think me OK and also
accept that it's OK for me to think its not worth wasting a lot of this
one and only life that I'm going to get beating myself up thinking: "how
not perfect I am".

FWIW, I have in the past taken comfort from these words in AA BB:

"We are not saints. ........ we are willing to grow along spiritual
lines ............... we claim
spiritual progress rather than spiritual perfection" (page 60)

Love and best wishes

Sheenah

what I think I'd need to be in order to be "perfect".on living fklef
OKthat also of myself. And with the




I can also accept that I am human can do my best only os





in my eyes and or other people's eyes what other people have that
canat I can only do my best pet The common factor in the above is this:
"When try to live up to what I think is expected of me and don;tson - in
other words I set standards- and then think I am not meeting those
expectations, , peiogen I try up I was tryingtha I thought thmeAlthough
The point of the

balevalired

balefound life for me being had a really hard time , cliniclalyahppy
and becamse very unhappyhe required of me.

was expected of me. it ipossbile to live up to what as a "good lifewhat
God I tried and therefore spend etenrity ifre wereping to be inould ,
Ik, iuan, - an elderyl SSthatbelieved that i much younger,







I am
> trying so hard to be what I think God wants me to be and am always
> second guessing myself after I do something that I think is good. I
> start obsessing on whether I did it without expecting anything in
> return and then I always think that if is selfish of me because I will
> get something out of it, even if only a blessing from God. Can I
really
> do anthing without not expecting something in return, even if it is
> from God. All this stuff is just going around and around and around in
> my head constantly.
>
> Then, there are the religious types that I do not want to be like. The
> other day during one of the groups that I facilitate, I said the f
> word. Well, after the group this man that profess's his love for Jesus
> Christ stayed after the meeting and gave me a sermon on watching how I
> talk. I had apologized immediately after I said it and said that I
hope
> I didn't offend anyone. He proceeded to stay and talk for 45 minutes
> and then wanted to pray for me and my family. I let him, and God knows
> me and my family need prayers, but I felt like he was looking down on
> me and I don't want to be that kind of Christian. He could have left
> and prayed for me and my family and accepted me for being human. Am I
> wrong to feel that way? I should just accept him and pray for him.
> After reading that previous sentences I realized I was expecting him
to
> do something I should be doing. (Chuckle for the day on me)
>
> Anyway, my husband and I are starting a different recovery group this
> Friday. It is a Christ centered recovery program in a church near us.
I
> have some friends who have been long time AA'ers and are involved with
> programs like this in their church. I am looking forward to starting
> it.
>
> Any feedback from you all will be appreciated.
>
> And Rosie, before you ask or tell me to go, no I haven't been to AA
and
> no I don't have a sponsor. I have e-mailed back and forth with my
> girlfriend who is in recovery.
>
> Best to all,
> Gail
>

[stuart]

Robert McGregor <robert_mcgregor@knickers.yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:4372cbc8$0$9835$c30e37c6@ken-reader.news.telstra.net...
>
> "stuart" <fred@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:Rezcf.118693$yS6.55751@clgrps12...
> >
> > We addicts in recovery use the "I" word a lot in our musings as a
> > general
> > rule, myself included. It does reveal something about the writer to
> > a reader
> > sometimes.
> >
>
> Other than in a case of demonic possession, or multiple
> personalities, can anyone here imagine a situation where one could
> write of oneself, at length, *without* monotonous repetition of the
> proverbial "I"
>
> The irony surrounding Stuart is to whom amongst his multiple
> personalities any individual "I" pertains. http://tinyurl.com/asdly
>
> Bob

We're getting a new Shrink in December. We thought a Muslim might help us
out. Hope he stays away from the community computer Bob.

[Robert McGregor]

"stuart" <fred@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:UOIcf.137361$Io.75688@clgrps13...
>
> Robert McGregor <robert_mcgregor@knickers.yahoo.com.au> wrote in
> message
> news:4372cbc8$0$9835$c30e37c6@ken-reader.news.telstra.net...
>>
>> "stuart" <fred@nospam.com> wrote in message
>> news:Rezcf.118693$yS6.55751@clgrps12...
>> >
>> > We addicts in recovery use the "I" word a lot in our musings as
>> > a
>> > general
>> > rule, myself included. It does reveal something about the writer
>> > to
>> > a reader
>> > sometimes.
>> >
>>
>> Other than in a case of demonic possession, or multiple
>> personalities, can anyone here imagine a situation where one could
>> write of oneself, at length, *without* monotonous repetition of
>> the
>> proverbial "I"
>>
>> The irony surrounding Stuart is to whom amongst his multiple
>> personalities any individual "I" pertains.
>> http://tinyurl.com/asdly
>>
>> Bob
>
> We're getting a new Shrink in December. We thought a Muslim might
> help us
> out. Hope he stays away from the community computer Bob.
>

Granting Islam and Psychiatry are mutually exclusive, should your
multiple thoughts materialise, at least any pesky Demons could be
exorcised from your computer, at last.

Perchance it's a blind Muslim, those pesky multiple I's would be made
redundant, two!

Bob

[stuart]

"Robert McGregor" <robert_mcgregor@knickers.yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:43736b48$0$9819$c30e37c6@ken-reader.news.telstra.net...
>
> "stuart" <fred@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:UOIcf.137361$Io.75688@clgrps13...
>>
>> Robert McGregor <robert_mcgregor@knickers.yahoo.com.au> wrote in
>> message
>> news:4372cbc8$0$9835$c30e37c6@ken-reader.news.telstra.net...
>>>
>>> "stuart" <fred@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>> news:Rezcf.118693$yS6.55751@clgrps12...
>>> >
>>> > We addicts in recovery use the "I" word a lot in our musings as
>>> > a
>>> > general
>>> > rule, myself included. It does reveal something about the writer
>>> > to
>>> > a reader
>>> > sometimes.
>>> >
>>>
>>> Other than in a case of demonic possession, or multiple
>>> personalities, can anyone here imagine a situation where one could
>>> write of oneself, at length, *without* monotonous repetition of
>>> the
>>> proverbial "I"
>>>
>>> The irony surrounding Stuart is to whom amongst his multiple
>>> personalities any individual "I" pertains.
>>> http://tinyurl.com/asdly
>>>
>>> Bob
>>
>> We're getting a new Shrink in December. We thought a Muslim might
>> help us
>> out. Hope he stays away from the community computer Bob.
>>
>
> Granting Islam and Psychiatry are mutually exclusive, should your
> multiple thoughts materialise, at least any pesky Demons could be
> exorcised from your computer, at last.
>
> Perchance it's a blind Muslim, those pesky multiple I's would be made
> redundant, two!
>
> Bob

Gotta question for you Bob.
When a deaf/mute needs to buy a toothbrush, he can communicate his
requirement to the drug-store clerk by making an up and down motion in front
of his teeth with his finger. How then does a blind man communicate to the
clerk if needs to buy a pair of sunglasses?

[Gail]

"Sheenah" <JBcatRB@coldman.com> wrote in message
news:dkvl51$ft5$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...

>
> Gail,
>
> FWIW, when just a child I was told by my Sunday School teacher, that if
> I did not live a good life, when Jesus came again - which was, according
> to this woman, going to be in my lifetime but not her's - I'd not be
> saved. So for a time I tried to live what I thought God's view of a
> "good life" was. Bcause I often felt myself unable to meet what I
> thought his view was, I got mentally screwed up, very unhappy and
> thought life unbearable.
>
> Over the years the I have tried also to live up to what I have either
> thought other people's expectations of me have been, what people have
> tried to get me to do and also my own expectations/standards. Again,
> when my mind has let me believe that I have not lived up to these
> expectations, often I have become mentally screwed up, very unhappy and
> thought life unbearable.
>
> I have come to believe that only when I have on my "sensible" head can I
> easily accept the suggestion that I not let thoughts about me being in
> either my eyes and sometimes other people's eyes not perfect , screw me
> up. With that same head on, I can easily accept that despite all my
> imperfections and character defects, some people think me OK and also
> accept that it's OK for me to think its not worth wasting a lot of this
> one and only life that I'm going to get beating myself up thinking: "how
> not perfect I am".
>
> FWIW, I have in the past taken comfort from these words in AA BB:
>
> "We are not saints. ........ we are willing to grow along spiritual
> lines ............... we claim
> spiritual progress rather than spiritual perfection" (page 60)
>
> Love and best wishes
>
> Sheenah

Thanks Sheenah. Please don't let my butt forget these things. I made it to 2
AA meetings today. It felt good to be back. Even went out to lunch with some
gals after the noon meeting. About the only thing I felt guilty about today
was leaving my dog twice in one day. That's a lot better than I felt
yesterday. I need you and the others in here to stay on me to do what I must
do and if you see me slipping you have my permission to tell me so. I know
it is up to me to do what is suggested. I have to do it and no way around it
if I want out of this mess in my head.
I knew today I was going to be ok when on my way to the noon meeting I was
listening to the radio and started crying to "Your one, twice, three times a
lady, and I love you".
Got home tonight and my best friend from elementary school called and we
talked for over an hour. We have not seen or talked to each other maybe 2 or
3 times in the past 40 years. It was a nice way to end the evening.
One more thing. What you said below, is this in code or did your cats get on
the keyboard again? I tried to read between the lines, change the letters
around in some of the words, and still couldn't make it out clearly. I got
some of it. ;)
Love back atcha!
Gail

>
> what I think I'd need to be in order to be "perfect".on living fklef
> OKthat also of myself. And with the
>
>
>
>
> I can also accept that I am human can do my best only os
>
>
>
>
>
> in my eyes and or other people's eyes what other people have that
> canat I can only do my best pet The common factor in the above is this:
> "When try to live up to what I think is expected of me and don;tson - in
> other words I set standards- and then think I am not meeting those
> expectations, , peiogen I try up I was tryingtha I thought thmeAlthough
> The point of the
>
> balevalired
>
> balefound life for me being had a really hard time , cliniclalyahppy
> and becamse very unhappyhe required of me.
>
> was expected of me. it ipossbile to live up to what as a "good lifewhat
> God I tried and therefore spend etenrity ifre wereping to be inould ,
> Ik, iuan, - an elderyl SSthatbelieved that i much younger,
>

[Lost in Space]

Hi Gail.

Hope this advice helps.

Your dog(s) have no sense of time, meaning yesterday is gone,
tomorrow hasn't happen... And the present moment awareness
kicks in when you arrive home that they greet you with a wagging tail.

Wouldn't it be nice to have a life like that ! A dogs life.

Start looking at your life through dog's
mind. He is concerned only with what is happening NOW. Chasing a
frisbee, rolling on his back. He doesn't dwell on the dug up garden,
or barking through the fence at strangers. He knows he suppose to do
those things because he's a dog !

[Gail]

Thanks!


"Lost in Space" <gwbdopesmoker@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1131735163.612046.120630@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>
>
> Hi Gail.
>
> Hope this advice helps.
>
> Your dog(s) have no sense of time, meaning yesterday is gone,
> tomorrow hasn't happen... And the present moment awareness
> kicks in when you arrive home that they greet you with a wagging tail.
>
> Wouldn't it be nice to have a life like that ! A dogs life.
>
> Start looking at your life through dog's
> mind. He is concerned only with what is happening NOW. Chasing a
> frisbee, rolling on his back. He doesn't dwell on the dug up garden,
> or barking through the fence at strangers. He knows he suppose to do
> those things because he's a dog !
>