day 2

[Crystal]

okay, today I spent the morning having chest pains and dizziness and its
just day 2. took me 1-1/2 hours to fall asleep last night, but still
managed a good solid 4 hours or so. feeling really really tired right now.
staying up to watch a show and the nightly news and then hopefully I can
sleep better, I should get so tired that you'd think I wouldn't have a
problem. guzzling sugar free koolaid, eating slim jims and cheese. :)

[Gregg Fowler]

Crystal wrote:
> okay, today I spent the morning having chest pains and dizziness and its
> just day 2. took me 1-1/2 hours to fall asleep last night, but still
> managed a good solid 4 hours or so. feeling really really tired right now.
> staying up to watch a show and the nightly news and then hopefully I can
> sleep better, I should get so tired that you'd think I wouldn't have a
> problem. guzzling sugar free koolaid, eating slim jims and cheese. :)
>
>
>
>
Way to go Crystal. Keep guzzling and eating. Glad you are taking the plunge.

Gregg

[John Droge]

"Crystal" <idontlikeemail@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:7QvMe.4722$j21.3438@news01.roc.ny...
> okay, today I spent the morning having chest pains and dizziness and its
> just day 2. took me 1-1/2 hours to fall asleep last night, but still
> managed a good solid 4 hours or so. feeling really really tired right
now.
> staying up to watch a show and the nightly news and then hopefully I can
> sleep better, I should get so tired that you'd think I wouldn't have a
> problem. guzzling sugar free koolaid, eating slim jims and cheese. :)
>
>
Crystal
Congratulations on day 2. Your doing a very unnatural thing for an
alcoholic--not drinking. It's tough but worth it.
I hope that you get yourself some support other then here. AA saved my ass
when it fell off and it can save yours too. Give it a try, you can always
have your misery back afterwards if you want it.
Peace
John

[stuart]

John Droge <jhdroge@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:OscNe.9721$Je.3954@newsread2.news.atl.earthli nk.net...
>
> "Crystal" <idontlikeemail@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:7QvMe.4722$j21.3438@news01.roc.ny...
> > okay, today I spent the morning having chest pains and dizziness and its
> > just day 2. took me 1-1/2 hours to fall asleep last night, but still
> > managed a good solid 4 hours or so. feeling really really tired right
> now.
> > staying up to watch a show and the nightly news and then hopefully I can
> > sleep better, I should get so tired that you'd think I wouldn't have a
> > problem. guzzling sugar free koolaid, eating slim jims and cheese. :)
> >
> >
> Crystal
> Congratulations on day 2. Your doing a very unnatural thing for an
> alcoholic--not drinking. It's tough but worth it.
> I hope that you get yourself some support other then here. AA saved my ass
> when it fell off and it can save yours too. Give it a try, you can always
> have your misery back afterwards if you want it.
> Peace
> John

John;

I know you mean well, but a) you pronounced Crystal an alcoholic, only she
can and should do that.b) she has not expressed and prior misery as far as I
can tell. My take is she just wants to stop drinking and has an otherwise
happy and well-adjusted life. She may not be an alcoholic, and she may not
need AA. Remember the chapter in the BB about the "heavy drinker" who can
quit or moderate with perhaps some difficulty and who may require help.
We tend to project ourselves on others as if they are always the same as us,
and none of us can really assume that can we?

[someone in need]

On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 04:53:03 GMT, "stuart" <fred@nospam.com> wrote:

>
>John Droge <jhdroge@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:OscNe.9721$Je.3954@newsread2.news.atl.earthli nk.net...
>>
>> "Crystal" <idontlikeemail@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:7QvMe.4722$j21.3438@news01.roc.ny...
>> > okay, today I spent the morning having chest pains and dizziness and its
>> > just day 2. took me 1-1/2 hours to fall asleep last night, but still
>> > managed a good solid 4 hours or so. feeling really really tired right
>> now.
>> > staying up to watch a show and the nightly news and then hopefully I can
>> > sleep better, I should get so tired that you'd think I wouldn't have a
>> > problem. guzzling sugar free koolaid, eating slim jims and cheese. :)
>> >
>> >
>> Crystal
>> Congratulations on day 2. Your doing a very unnatural thing for an
>> alcoholic--not drinking. It's tough but worth it.
>> I hope that you get yourself some support other then here. AA saved my ass
>> when it fell off and it can save yours too. Give it a try, you can always
>> have your misery back afterwards if you want it.
>> Peace
>> John
>
>John;
>
>I know you mean well, but a) you pronounced Crystal an alcoholic, only she
>can and should do that.b) she has not expressed and prior misery as far as I
>can tell. My take is she just wants to stop drinking and has an otherwise
>happy and well-adjusted life. She may not be an alcoholic, and she may not
>need AA. Remember the chapter in the BB about the "heavy drinker" who can
>quit or moderate with perhaps some difficulty and who may require help.
>We tend to project ourselves on others as if they are always the same as us,
>and none of us can really assume that can we?
>



"chest pains and dizziness" is sure c/w alcoholism.

Needing to drink indefinitely sure is more miserable than going
through a one shot deal of getting over withdrawl. No pun intended.

[stuart]

someone in need <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:rjuag11ioc5c7f29lea9ffnvsd7at601ek@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 04:53:03 GMT, "stuart" <fred@nospam.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >John Droge <jhdroge@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> >news:OscNe.9721$Je.3954@newsread2.news.atl.earthli nk.net...
> >>
> >> "Crystal" <idontlikeemail@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >> news:7QvMe.4722$j21.3438@news01.roc.ny...
> >> > okay, today I spent the morning having chest pains and dizziness and
its
> >> > just day 2. took me 1-1/2 hours to fall asleep last night, but still
> >> > managed a good solid 4 hours or so. feeling really really tired
right
> >> now.
> >> > staying up to watch a show and the nightly news and then hopefully I
can
> >> > sleep better, I should get so tired that you'd think I wouldn't have
a
> >> > problem. guzzling sugar free koolaid, eating slim jims and cheese.
:)
> >> >
> >> >
> >> Crystal
> >> Congratulations on day 2. Your doing a very unnatural thing for an
> >> alcoholic--not drinking. It's tough but worth it.
> >> I hope that you get yourself some support other then here. AA saved my
ass
> >> when it fell off and it can save yours too. Give it a try, you can
always
> >> have your misery back afterwards if you want it.
> >> Peace
> >> John
> >
> >John;
> >
> >I know you mean well, but a) you pronounced Crystal an alcoholic, only
she
> >can and should do that.b) she has not expressed and prior misery as far
as I
> >can tell. My take is she just wants to stop drinking and has an otherwise
> >happy and well-adjusted life. She may not be an alcoholic, and she may
not
> >need AA. Remember the chapter in the BB about the "heavy drinker" who can
> >quit or moderate with perhaps some difficulty and who may require help.
> >We tend to project ourselves on others as if they are always the same as
us,
> >and none of us can really assume that can we?
> >
>
>
>
> "chest pains and dizziness" is sure c/w alcoholism.

"chest pains and dizziness' can occur for dozens of different unrelated
reasons, one being related to her being overweight
Neither you nor I or anyone else has enough information about in this
instance to make pronouncements...

Ever since I csme into the program, I've noted that AA is chock full of
armchair psychologists, psychiatrists and physicians.:-)
Never never make a diagnosis without examining the patient, that is
assuming you have had training in clinical examination and diagnosis, not to
mention a few pathology courses....;-(

>
> Needing to drink indefinitely sure is more miserable than going
> through a one shot deal of getting over withdrawl. No pun intended.

[Anon Tom]

On Tue, 16 Aug 2005 20:49:07 -0400, Crystal wrote
(in article <7QvMe.4722$j21.3438@news01.roc.ny>):

> okay, today I spent the morning having chest pains and dizziness and its
> just day 2. took me 1-1/2 hours to fall asleep last night, but still
> managed a good solid 4 hours or so. feeling really really tired right now.
> staying up to watch a show and the nightly news and then hopefully I can
> sleep better, I should get so tired that you'd think I wouldn't have a
> problem. guzzling sugar free koolaid, eating slim jims and cheese. :)

Hang in there. My first few nights were sleepless as well (had night sweats
too). It can be very frustrating -- negative thoughts popped into my head
like "I felt better when I was drinking." I was so tired all the time (and
complained about it to this group)... didn't start to feel like my old,
pre-alcoholic, self for a good 2 weeks.


Tom

[someone in need]

>> "chest pains and dizziness" is sure c/w alcoholism.
>
>"chest pains and dizziness' can occur for dozens of different unrelated
>reasons, one being related to her being overweight
>Neither you nor I or anyone else has enough information about in this
>instance to make pronouncements...
>
>Ever since I csme into the program, I've noted that AA is chock full of
>armchair psychologists, psychiatrists and physicians.:-)
>Never never make a diagnosis without examining the patient, that is
>assuming you have had training in clinical examination and diagnosis, not to
>mention a few pathology courses....;-(
>
>>
>> Needing to drink indefinitely sure is more miserable than going
>> through a one shot deal of getting over withdrawl. No pun intended.
>





No one is making a diagnosis. the symptoms of cp and dizzyness that do
not occur short of abstinence IS consistent with etoh withdrawl.

Now if cp and dizzyness are a routine occurence for a person then it
might not alarm them if it happens again post abstinence.


You hypothesize the sx may be related to obesity yet you fail to
mention it should be medically evaluated. You are correct in that
there is not enough information to absolutely know the etx of the sx.
which no one is claiming.

[stuart]

"someone in need" <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:jc2cg1567re47gjbdrhgi20qp3v80r4e1r@4ax.com...
>
>
>>> "chest pains and dizziness" is sure c/w alcoholism.
>>
>>"chest pains and dizziness' can occur for dozens of different unrelated
>>reasons, one being related to her being overweight
>>Neither you nor I or anyone else has enough information about in this
>>instance to make pronouncements...
>>
>>Ever since I csme into the program, I've noted that AA is chock full of
>>armchair psychologists, psychiatrists and physicians.:-)
>>Never never make a diagnosis without examining the patient, that is
>>assuming you have had training in clinical examination and diagnosis, not
>>to
>>mention a few pathology courses....;-(
>>
>>>
>>> Needing to drink indefinitely sure is more miserable than going
>>> through a one shot deal of getting over withdrawl. No pun intended.
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> No one is making a diagnosis. the symptoms of cp and dizzyness that do
> not occur short of abstinence IS consistent with etoh withdrawl.
>
> Now if cp and dizzyness are a routine occurence for a person then it
> might not alarm them if it happens again post abstinence.
>
>
> You hypothesize the sx may be related to obesity yet you fail to
> mention it should be medically evaluated. You are correct in that
> there is not enough information to absolutely know the etx of the sx.
> which no one is claiming.

You missed my point my good man. I wasn't hypothesizing anything. I wasn't
recommending anything relative to this lady, either
What I was saying is exactly that. No one can hypothesize. We cannot
pronounce her an alcoholic either.

Here's the post I was discussing;

"Crystal
Congratulations on day 2. Your doing a very unnatural thing for an
alcoholic--not drinking. It's tough but worth it.
I hope that you get yourself some support other then here. AA saved my ass
when it fell off and it can save yours too. Give it a try, you can always
have your misery back afterwards if you want it.
Peace
John"

You see, this well meaning chap stated that she was doing "a very unnatural
thing for an alcoholic" which is no doubt true, if she is actually an
alcoholic. She indeed may not be an alcoholic.
The issue I was trying to raise, and the arfers jump all over it, is the
notion that we like to suggest one size fits all, based on our own
experience, and that's just not true in any arena using common sense. I
suggest we must get away from those conclusions in yor discourse with
others, that's all

[someone in need]

On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 17:22:34 GMT, "stuart" <ggo@feds.org> wrote:

>
>"someone in need" <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
>news:jc2cg1567re47gjbdrhgi20qp3v80r4e1r@4ax.com...
>>
>>
>>>> "chest pains and dizziness" is sure c/w alcoholism.
>>>
>>>"chest pains and dizziness' can occur for dozens of different unrelated
>>>reasons, one being related to her being overweight
>>>Neither you nor I or anyone else has enough information about in this
>>>instance to make pronouncements...
>>>
>>>Ever since I csme into the program, I've noted that AA is chock full of
>>>armchair psychologists, psychiatrists and physicians.:-)
>>>Never never make a diagnosis without examining the patient, that is
>>>assuming you have had training in clinical examination and diagnosis, not
>>>to
>>>mention a few pathology courses....;-(
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Needing to drink indefinitely sure is more miserable than going
>>>> through a one shot deal of getting over withdrawl. No pun intended.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> No one is making a diagnosis. the symptoms of cp and dizzyness that do
>> not occur short of abstinence IS consistent with etoh withdrawl.
>>
>> Now if cp and dizzyness are a routine occurence for a person then it
>> might not alarm them if it happens again post abstinence.
>>
>>
>> You hypothesize the sx may be related to obesity yet you fail to
>> mention it should be medically evaluated. You are correct in that
>> there is not enough information to absolutely know the etx of the sx.
>> which no one is claiming.
>
>You missed my point my good man. I wasn't hypothesizing anything. I wasn't
>recommending anything relative to this lady, either
>What I was saying is exactly that. No one can hypothesize. We cannot
>pronounce her an alcoholic either.
>
>Here's the post I was discussing;
>
>"Crystal
>Congratulations on day 2. Your doing a very unnatural thing for an
>alcoholic--not drinking. It's tough but worth it.
>I hope that you get yourself some support other then here. AA saved my ass
>when it fell off and it can save yours too. Give it a try, you can always
>have your misery back afterwards if you want it.
>Peace
>John"
>
>You see, this well meaning chap stated that she was doing "a very unnatural
>thing for an alcoholic" which is no doubt true, if she is actually an
>alcoholic. She indeed may not be an alcoholic.
>The issue I was trying to raise, and the arfers jump all over it, is the
>notion that we like to suggest one size fits all, based on our own
>experience, and that's just not true in any arena using common sense. I
>suggest we must get away from those conclusions in yor discourse with
>others, that's all
>
>



If indeed her chest pain and dizzyness are the result of abstinence
would this not be consistent with withdrawl?

[stuart]

"someone in need" <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:bp9cg1pk69qeqgpl7j67i57q0spqsd25pd@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 17:22:34 GMT, "stuart" <ggo@feds.org> wrote:
>
>>
>>"someone in need" <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
>>news:jc2cg1567re47gjbdrhgi20qp3v80r4e1r@4ax.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>>> "chest pains and dizziness" is sure c/w alcoholism.
>>>>
>>>>"chest pains and dizziness' can occur for dozens of different unrelated
>>>>reasons, one being related to her being overweight
>>>>Neither you nor I or anyone else has enough information about in this
>>>>instance to make pronouncements...
>>>>
>>>>Ever since I csme into the program, I've noted that AA is chock full of
>>>>armchair psychologists, psychiatrists and physicians.:-)
>>>>Never never make a diagnosis without examining the patient, that is
>>>>assuming you have had training in clinical examination and diagnosis,
>>>>not
>>>>to
>>>>mention a few pathology courses....;-(
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Needing to drink indefinitely sure is more miserable than going
>>>>> through a one shot deal of getting over withdrawl. No pun intended.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> No one is making a diagnosis. the symptoms of cp and dizzyness that do
>>> not occur short of abstinence IS consistent with etoh withdrawl.
>>>
>>> Now if cp and dizzyness are a routine occurence for a person then it
>>> might not alarm them if it happens again post abstinence.
>>>
>>>
>>> You hypothesize the sx may be related to obesity yet you fail to
>>> mention it should be medically evaluated. You are correct in that
>>> there is not enough information to absolutely know the etx of the sx.
>>> which no one is claiming.
>>
>>You missed my point my good man. I wasn't hypothesizing anything. I wasn't
>>recommending anything relative to this lady, either
>>What I was saying is exactly that. No one can hypothesize. We cannot
>>pronounce her an alcoholic either.
>>
>>Here's the post I was discussing;
>>
>>"Crystal
>>Congratulations on day 2. Your doing a very unnatural thing for an
>>alcoholic--not drinking. It's tough but worth it.
>>I hope that you get yourself some support other then here. AA saved my ass
>>when it fell off and it can save yours too. Give it a try, you can always
>>have your misery back afterwards if you want it.
>>Peace
>>John"
>>
>>You see, this well meaning chap stated that she was doing "a very
>>unnatural
>>thing for an alcoholic" which is no doubt true, if she is actually an
>>alcoholic. She indeed may not be an alcoholic.
>>The issue I was trying to raise, and the arfers jump all over it, is the
>>notion that we like to suggest one size fits all, based on our own
>>experience, and that's just not true in any arena using common sense. I
>>suggest we must get away from those conclusions in yor discourse with
>>others, that's all
>>
>>
>
>
>
> If indeed her chest pain and dizzyness are the result of abstinence
> would this not be consistent with withdrawl?

Mebbe possible sure its in the Merck, but that's not the point i was trying
to make. Go back in Crytal's posts and you wil understand why i am rasing a
concern over John's declarations on her. it might not be helpful to her

[nospam]

On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 20:42:51 GMT, "stuart" <ggo@feds.org> wrote:

>
>"someone in need" <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
>news:bp9cg1pk69qeqgpl7j67i57q0spqsd25pd@4ax.com...
>> On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 17:22:34 GMT, "stuart" <ggo@feds.org> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"someone in need" <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
>>>news:jc2cg1567re47gjbdrhgi20qp3v80r4e1r@4ax.com...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> "chest pains and dizziness" is sure c/w alcoholism.
>>>>>
>>>>>"chest pains and dizziness' can occur for dozens of different unrelated
>>>>>reasons, one being related to her being overweight
>>>>>Neither you nor I or anyone else has enough information about in this
>>>>>instance to make pronouncements...
>>>>>
>>>>>Ever since I csme into the program, I've noted that AA is chock full of
>>>>>armchair psychologists, psychiatrists and physicians.:-)
>>>>>Never never make a diagnosis without examining the patient, that is
>>>>>assuming you have had training in clinical examination and diagnosis,
>>>>>not
>>>>>to
>>>>>mention a few pathology courses....;-(
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Needing to drink indefinitely sure is more miserable than going
>>>>>> through a one shot deal of getting over withdrawl. No pun intended.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> No one is making a diagnosis. the symptoms of cp and dizzyness that do
>>>> not occur short of abstinence IS consistent with etoh withdrawl.
>>>>
>>>> Now if cp and dizzyness are a routine occurence for a person then it
>>>> might not alarm them if it happens again post abstinence.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You hypothesize the sx may be related to obesity yet you fail to
>>>> mention it should be medically evaluated. You are correct in that
>>>> there is not enough information to absolutely know the etx of the sx.
>>>> which no one is claiming.
>>>
>>>You missed my point my good man. I wasn't hypothesizing anything. I wasn't
>>>recommending anything relative to this lady, either
>>>What I was saying is exactly that. No one can hypothesize. We cannot
>>>pronounce her an alcoholic either.
>>>
>>>Here's the post I was discussing;
>>>
>>>"Crystal
>>>Congratulations on day 2. Your doing a very unnatural thing for an
>>>alcoholic--not drinking. It's tough but worth it.
>>>I hope that you get yourself some support other then here. AA saved my ass
>>>when it fell off and it can save yours too. Give it a try, you can always
>>>have your misery back afterwards if you want it.
>>>Peace
>>>John"
>>>
>>>You see, this well meaning chap stated that she was doing "a very
>>>unnatural
>>>thing for an alcoholic" which is no doubt true, if she is actually an
>>>alcoholic. She indeed may not be an alcoholic.
>>>The issue I was trying to raise, and the arfers jump all over it, is the
>>>notion that we like to suggest one size fits all, based on our own
>>>experience, and that's just not true in any arena using common sense. I
>>>suggest we must get away from those conclusions in yor discourse with
>>>others, that's all
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> If indeed her chest pain and dizzyness are the result of abstinence
>> would this not be consistent with withdrawl?
>
>Mebbe possible sure its in the Merck, but that's not the point i was trying
>to make. Go back in Crytal's posts and you wil understand why i am rasing a
>concern over John's declarations on her. it might not be helpful to her
>

Think its also in Harrisons, Cecil, and Tintinalli's

[nospam]

On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 20:42:51 GMT, "stuart" <ggo@feds.org> wrote:

>
>"someone in need" <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
>news:bp9cg1pk69qeqgpl7j67i57q0spqsd25pd@4ax.com...
>> On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 17:22:34 GMT, "stuart" <ggo@feds.org> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"someone in need" <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
>>>news:jc2cg1567re47gjbdrhgi20qp3v80r4e1r@4ax.com...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> "chest pains and dizziness" is sure c/w alcoholism.
>>>>>
>>>>>"chest pains and dizziness' can occur for dozens of different unrelated
>>>>>reasons, one being related to her being overweight
>>>>>Neither you nor I or anyone else has enough information about in this
>>>>>instance to make pronouncements...
>>>>>
>>>>>Ever since I csme into the program, I've noted that AA is chock full of
>>>>>armchair psychologists, psychiatrists and physicians.:-)
>>>>>Never never make a diagnosis without examining the patient, that is
>>>>>assuming you have had training in clinical examination and diagnosis,
>>>>>not
>>>>>to
>>>>>mention a few pathology courses....;-(
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Needing to drink indefinitely sure is more miserable than going
>>>>>> through a one shot deal of getting over withdrawl. No pun intended.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> No one is making a diagnosis. the symptoms of cp and dizzyness that do
>>>> not occur short of abstinence IS consistent with etoh withdrawl.
>>>>
>>>> Now if cp and dizzyness are a routine occurence for a person then it
>>>> might not alarm them if it happens again post abstinence.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You hypothesize the sx may be related to obesity yet you fail to
>>>> mention it should be medically evaluated. You are correct in that
>>>> there is not enough information to absolutely know the etx of the sx.
>>>> which no one is claiming.
>>>
>>>You missed my point my good man. I wasn't hypothesizing anything. I wasn't
>>>recommending anything relative to this lady, either
>>>What I was saying is exactly that. No one can hypothesize. We cannot
>>>pronounce her an alcoholic either.
>>>
>>>Here's the post I was discussing;
>>>
>>>"Crystal
>>>Congratulations on day 2. Your doing a very unnatural thing for an
>>>alcoholic--not drinking. It's tough but worth it.
>>>I hope that you get yourself some support other then here. AA saved my ass
>>>when it fell off and it can save yours too. Give it a try, you can always
>>>have your misery back afterwards if you want it.
>>>Peace
>>>John"
>>>
>>>You see, this well meaning chap stated that she was doing "a very
>>>unnatural
>>>thing for an alcoholic" which is no doubt true, if she is actually an
>>>alcoholic. She indeed may not be an alcoholic.
>>>The issue I was trying to raise, and the arfers jump all over it, is the
>>>notion that we like to suggest one size fits all, based on our own
>>>experience, and that's just not true in any arena using common sense. I
>>>suggest we must get away from those conclusions in yor discourse with
>>>others, that's all
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> If indeed her chest pain and dizzyness are the result of abstinence
>> would this not be consistent with withdrawl?
>
>Mebbe possible sure its in the Merck, but that's not the point i was trying
>to make. Go back in Crytal's posts and you wil understand why i am rasing a
>concern over John's declarations on her. it might not be helpful to her
>

Think its also in Harrisons, Cecil, and Tintinalli's

[someone in need]

On Sat, 20 Aug 2005 06:23:51 GMT, nospam <nospamplease@somewhere.com>
wrote:

>On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 20:42:51 GMT, "stuart" <ggo@feds.org> wrote:
>
>>
>>"someone in need" <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
>>news:bp9cg1pk69qeqgpl7j67i57q0spqsd25pd@4ax.com...
>>> On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 17:22:34 GMT, "stuart" <ggo@feds.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"someone in need" <nospamplease@somewhere.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:jc2cg1567re47gjbdrhgi20qp3v80r4e1r@4ax.com...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> "chest pains and dizziness" is sure c/w alcoholism.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"chest pains and dizziness' can occur for dozens of different unrelated
>>>>>>reasons, one being related to her being overweight
>>>>>>Neither you nor I or anyone else has enough information about in this
>>>>>>instance to make pronouncements...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Ever since I csme into the program, I've noted that AA is chock full of
>>>>>>armchair psychologists, psychiatrists and physicians.:-)
>>>>>>Never never make a diagnosis without examining the patient, that is
>>>>>>assuming you have had training in clinical examination and diagnosis,
>>>>>>not
>>>>>>to
>>>>>>mention a few pathology courses....;-(
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Needing to drink indefinitely sure is more miserable than going
>>>>>>> through a one shot deal of getting over withdrawl. No pun intended.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> No one is making a diagnosis. the symptoms of cp and dizzyness that do
>>>>> not occur short of abstinence IS consistent with etoh withdrawl.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now if cp and dizzyness are a routine occurence for a person then it
>>>>> might not alarm them if it happens again post abstinence.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> You hypothesize the sx may be related to obesity yet you fail to
>>>>> mention it should be medically evaluated. You are correct in that
>>>>> there is not enough information to absolutely know the etx of the sx.
>>>>> which no one is claiming.
>>>>
>>>>You missed my point my good man. I wasn't hypothesizing anything. I wasn't
>>>>recommending anything relative to this lady, either
>>>>What I was saying is exactly that. No one can hypothesize. We cannot
>>>>pronounce her an alcoholic either.
>>>>
>>>>Here's the post I was discussing;
>>>>
>>>>"Crystal
>>>>Congratulations on day 2. Your doing a very unnatural thing for an
>>>>alcoholic--not drinking. It's tough but worth it.
>>>>I hope that you get yourself some support other then here. AA saved my ass
>>>>when it fell off and it can save yours too. Give it a try, you can always
>>>>have your misery back afterwards if you want it.
>>>>Peace
>>>>John"
>>>>
>>>>You see, this well meaning chap stated that she was doing "a very
>>>>unnatural
>>>>thing for an alcoholic" which is no doubt true, if she is actually an
>>>>alcoholic. She indeed may not be an alcoholic.
>>>>The issue I was trying to raise, and the arfers jump all over it, is the
>>>>notion that we like to suggest one size fits all, based on our own
>>>>experience, and that's just not true in any arena using common sense. I
>>>>suggest we must get away from those conclusions in yor discourse with
>>>>others, that's all
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> If indeed her chest pain and dizzyness are the result of abstinence
>>> would this not be consistent with withdrawl?
>>
>>Mebbe possible sure its in the Merck, but that's not the point i was trying
>>to make. Go back in Crytal's posts and you wil understand why i am rasing a
>>concern over John's declarations on her. it might not be helpful to her
>>
>
>Think its also in Harrisons, Cecil, and Tintinalli's


sorry about the above 2 duplicate posts and the unintentional chnage
in user name.