The Liberal Betrayal of Alcholics Anonymous

[dougwa]

Early AA was a good thing. As Dr.Bob (one of the co-founders of AA)
said in his last major address to AA's:

"It wasnt until 1938 that the teachings and efforts and studies that
had been going on were crystallized in the form of the 12 steps.....We
already had the basic ideas....We got them, as I said , as a result of
our study of the Good Book"

How then did AA, a program with Christian Roots, evolve into a program
that has Gay AA meeting and Gay AA Roundups ( www.gayalcoholics.com).
Indeed, the new (and improved?) 4th Edition of Alcoholics Anonymous has
further deleted some of the Christian Testimonies of early AA pioneers
(Clarence Snyder of Cleveland Ohio: Home Brewmeister) and replaced it
with stories of unrepentant homosexuals: "Tightrope" **

The question is "How did it happen" .

The website of " International Advisory Council of Homosexual Men &
Women in AA) " gives us part of the answer to the sordid story. And it
involves betrayal at the highest levels of Alcholics Anonymous.

Alcoholics Anonymous has a tradition (Traditon 10) which states:

"Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence,the AA
name ought never be drawn into public controversy"

And the traditon served AA well for the first 40 years of its
existence. There were no officially designated "Gay" meetings during
that time. However, as society itself began to deteriorate and begin to
be more accepting of perversion, AA began to reflect this change.
Homosexual activists began clamoring for official acceptance within AA.
But they had to get around the traditon to do it. The General Services
Office of Alcoholics Anonymous was all too willing to help.

Gay Activists wrote a pamphlet entitled "The Homosexual Alcoholic -
A.A.'s Message of Hope to Gay Men and Women." They also published a
meeting list: " Meetings for Gay Recovering Alcoholics". Neither of
these publications were authorized AA publications. It was sort of an
underground AA.


Now let me quote from Nancy T., Arlington the homosexual activist
largely responsible compiling the gay meeting list:

" I made contact with the General Services Office, and sent them copies
of the pamphlet and directories. The GSO folks were very kind. Although
neither the pamphlet nor the directory were Conference approved, those
caring people in New York distributed the pieces of "literature" in
response to requests for information from gay/lesbian Alcoholics and
their friends and sponsors. They also referred people directly to me.
This began a cooperative relationship between the community of gay and
lesbian recovering alcoholics and the General Services Office that
endures to this day through IAC. "


There you are from the mouth of the woman who did it. Alcoholics
Anonymous General Serives Office promoting the homosexual agenda.
Distributing non-conference approved literature and directories to the
public in order to promote an outside issue: the acceptance of
homosexuality in society.

The General Service Office went further. In 1980 homosexual activists
were asked by the GSO staff to help plan two gay/lesbian workshops for
the 1980 International AA Convention.


It could not have happened with the connivance and approval of General
Service Office.Briefly, that is the story of the betrayal of Alcoholics
Anonymous by those trusted servants sworn to have no opinon on outside
issues.And we can be pretty sure they didnt get the idea from their
study of the Good Book.

Ted W
Ted W. is a long time member of Alcoholics Anonymous (28 Years). He is
a believer in Jesus Christ and writes on recovery related issues at
Http://Christianrecovery.blogspot.com

[dan mcgown]

Ohhhhh, poor dougie-poo! Are all us big, bad evil faggots ruining
him's wittle AA meeting? Grow up.
How about considering that one of the "public controversies" that AA is
not supposed to be drawn into is spreading your personal homophobic agenda?

"dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1120408563.410704.119170@g49g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>
> Early AA was a good thing. As Dr.Bob (one of the co-founders of AA)
> said in his last major address to AA's:
>
> "It wasnt until 1938 that the teachings and efforts and studies that
> had been going on were crystallized in the form of the 12 steps.....We
> already had the basic ideas....We got them, as I said , as a result of
> our study of the Good Book"
>
> How then did AA, a program with Christian Roots, evolve into a program
> that has Gay AA meeting and Gay AA Roundups ( www.gayalcoholics.com).
> Indeed, the new (and improved?) 4th Edition of Alcoholics Anonymous has
> further deleted some of the Christian Testimonies of early AA pioneers
> (Clarence Snyder of Cleveland Ohio: Home Brewmeister) and replaced it
> with stories of unrepentant homosexuals: "Tightrope" **
>
> The question is "How did it happen" .
>
> The website of " International Advisory Council of Homosexual Men &
> Women in AA) " gives us part of the answer to the sordid story. And it
> involves betrayal at the highest levels of Alcholics Anonymous.
>
> Alcoholics Anonymous has a tradition (Traditon 10) which states:
>
> "Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence,the AA
> name ought never be drawn into public controversy"
>
> And the traditon served AA well for the first 40 years of its
> existence. There were no officially designated "Gay" meetings during
> that time. However, as society itself began to deteriorate and begin to
> be more accepting of perversion, AA began to reflect this change.
> Homosexual activists began clamoring for official acceptance within AA.
> But they had to get around the traditon to do it. The General Services
> Office of Alcoholics Anonymous was all too willing to help.
>
> Gay Activists wrote a pamphlet entitled "The Homosexual Alcoholic -
> A.A.'s Message of Hope to Gay Men and Women." They also published a
> meeting list: " Meetings for Gay Recovering Alcoholics". Neither of
> these publications were authorized AA publications. It was sort of an
> underground AA.
>
>
> Now let me quote from Nancy T., Arlington the homosexual activist
> largely responsible compiling the gay meeting list:
>
> " I made contact with the General Services Office, and sent them copies
> of the pamphlet and directories. The GSO folks were very kind. Although
> neither the pamphlet nor the directory were Conference approved, those
> caring people in New York distributed the pieces of "literature" in
> response to requests for information from gay/lesbian Alcoholics and
> their friends and sponsors. They also referred people directly to me.
> This began a cooperative relationship between the community of gay and
> lesbian recovering alcoholics and the General Services Office that
> endures to this day through IAC. "
>
>
> There you are from the mouth of the woman who did it. Alcoholics
> Anonymous General Serives Office promoting the homosexual agenda.
> Distributing non-conference approved literature and directories to the
> public in order to promote an outside issue: the acceptance of
> homosexuality in society.
>
> The General Service Office went further. In 1980 homosexual activists
> were asked by the GSO staff to help plan two gay/lesbian workshops for
> the 1980 International AA Convention.
>
>
> It could not have happened with the connivance and approval of General
> Service Office.Briefly, that is the story of the betrayal of Alcoholics
> Anonymous by those trusted servants sworn to have no opinon on outside
> issues.And we can be pretty sure they didnt get the idea from their
> study of the Good Book.
>
> Ted W
> Ted W. is a long time member of Alcoholics Anonymous (28 Years). He is
> a believer in Jesus Christ and writes on recovery related issues at
> Http://Christianrecovery.blogspot.com
>

[John Droge]

"dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1120408563.410704.119170@g49g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>
> Early AA was a good thing. As Dr.Bob (one of the co-founders of AA)
> said in his last major address to AA's:
>
> "It wasnt until 1938 that the teachings and efforts and studies that
> had been going on were crystallized in the form of the 12 steps.....We
> already had the basic ideas....We got them, as I said , as a result of
> our study of the Good Book"
>
> How then did AA, a program with Christian Roots, evolve into a program
> that has Gay AA meeting and Gay AA Roundups ( www.gayalcoholics.com).
> Indeed, the new (and improved?) 4th Edition of Alcoholics Anonymous has
> further deleted some of the Christian Testimonies of early AA pioneers
> (Clarence Snyder of Cleveland Ohio: Home Brewmeister) and replaced it
> with stories of unrepentant homosexuals: "Tightrope" **
>
> The question is "How did it happen" .
>
> The website of " International Advisory Council of Homosexual Men &
> Women in AA) " gives us part of the answer to the sordid story. And it
> involves betrayal at the highest levels of Alcholics Anonymous.
>
> Alcoholics Anonymous has a tradition (Traditon 10) which states:
>
> "Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence,the AA
> name ought never be drawn into public controversy"
>
> And the traditon served AA well for the first 40 years of its
> existence. There were no officially designated "Gay" meetings during
> that time. However, as society itself began to deteriorate and begin to
> be more accepting of perversion, AA began to reflect this change.
> Homosexual activists began clamoring for official acceptance within AA.
> But they had to get around the traditon to do it. The General Services
> Office of Alcoholics Anonymous was all too willing to help.
>
> Gay Activists wrote a pamphlet entitled "The Homosexual Alcoholic -
> A.A.'s Message of Hope to Gay Men and Women." They also published a
> meeting list: " Meetings for Gay Recovering Alcoholics". Neither of
> these publications were authorized AA publications. It was sort of an
> underground AA.
>
>
> Now let me quote from Nancy T., Arlington the homosexual activist
> largely responsible compiling the gay meeting list:
>
> " I made contact with the General Services Office, and sent them copies
> of the pamphlet and directories. The GSO folks were very kind. Although
> neither the pamphlet nor the directory were Conference approved, those
> caring people in New York distributed the pieces of "literature" in
> response to requests for information from gay/lesbian Alcoholics and
> their friends and sponsors. They also referred people directly to me.
> This began a cooperative relationship between the community of gay and
> lesbian recovering alcoholics and the General Services Office that
> endures to this day through IAC. "
>
>
> There you are from the mouth of the woman who did it. Alcoholics
> Anonymous General Serives Office promoting the homosexual agenda.
> Distributing non-conference approved literature and directories to the
> public in order to promote an outside issue: the acceptance of
> homosexuality in society.
>
> The General Service Office went further. In 1980 homosexual activists
> were asked by the GSO staff to help plan two gay/lesbian workshops for
> the 1980 International AA Convention.
>
>
> It could not have happened with the connivance and approval of General
> Service Office.Briefly, that is the story of the betrayal of Alcoholics
> Anonymous by those trusted servants sworn to have no opinon on outside
> issues.And we can be pretty sure they didnt get the idea from their
> study of the Good Book.
>
> Ted W
> Ted W. is a long time member of Alcoholics Anonymous (28 Years). He is
> a believer in Jesus Christ and writes on recovery related issues at
> Http://Christianrecovery.blogspot.com
>

I know ain't it disgusting. Why they even let in long haired commie pinko
bleeding heart liberal old hippie retreads like me in these days. Yes I am
one of those people your parents warned you about.
But take heart spunky they also take in fascist running dog lackeys of the
capitalist imperial war mongers.Like the Big book says it's all about
balance.
Should have posted this in that "Other AA ng", probably would have gotten a
good response from Sepp and the Nazis'. But then We don't want to talk about
Them; wouldn't be PC and all that.
Peace
John ;-)~

[Jean Staffen]

Strongly suggest you reread the third tradition, Doug. The only
requirement for membership is still the desire to stop drinking.


dougwa wrote:
> Early AA was a good thing. As Dr.Bob (one of the co-founders of AA)
> said in his last major address to AA's:
>
> "It wasnt until 1938 that the teachings and efforts and studies that
> had been going on were crystallized in the form of the 12 steps.....We
> already had the basic ideas....We got them, as I said , as a result of
> our study of the Good Book"
>
> How then did AA, a program with Christian Roots, evolve into a program
> that has Gay AA meeting and Gay AA Roundups ( www.gayalcoholics.com).
> Indeed, the new (and improved?) 4th Edition of Alcoholics Anonymous has
> further deleted some of the Christian Testimonies of early AA pioneers
> (Clarence Snyder of Cleveland Ohio: Home Brewmeister) and replaced it
> with stories of unrepentant homosexuals: "Tightrope" **
>
> The question is "How did it happen" .
>
> The website of " International Advisory Council of Homosexual Men &
> Women in AA) " gives us part of the answer to the sordid story. And it
> involves betrayal at the highest levels of Alcholics Anonymous.
>
> Alcoholics Anonymous has a tradition (Traditon 10) which states:
>
> "Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence,the AA
> name ought never be drawn into public controversy"
>
> And the traditon served AA well for the first 40 years of its
> existence. There were no officially designated "Gay" meetings during
> that time. However, as society itself began to deteriorate and begin to
> be more accepting of perversion, AA began to reflect this change.
> Homosexual activists began clamoring for official acceptance within AA.
> But they had to get around the traditon to do it. The General Services
> Office of Alcoholics Anonymous was all too willing to help.
>
> Gay Activists wrote a pamphlet entitled "The Homosexual Alcoholic -
> A.A.'s Message of Hope to Gay Men and Women." They also published a
> meeting list: " Meetings for Gay Recovering Alcoholics". Neither of
> these publications were authorized AA publications. It was sort of an
> underground AA.
>
>
> Now let me quote from Nancy T., Arlington the homosexual activist
> largely responsible compiling the gay meeting list:
>
> " I made contact with the General Services Office, and sent them copies
> of the pamphlet and directories. The GSO folks were very kind. Although
> neither the pamphlet nor the directory were Conference approved, those
> caring people in New York distributed the pieces of "literature" in
> response to requests for information from gay/lesbian Alcoholics and
> their friends and sponsors. They also referred people directly to me.
> This began a cooperative relationship between the community of gay and
> lesbian recovering alcoholics and the General Services Office that
> endures to this day through IAC. "
>
>
> There you are from the mouth of the woman who did it. Alcoholics
> Anonymous General Serives Office promoting the homosexual agenda.
> Distributing non-conference approved literature and directories to the
> public in order to promote an outside issue: the acceptance of
> homosexuality in society.
>
> The General Service Office went further. In 1980 homosexual activists
> were asked by the GSO staff to help plan two gay/lesbian workshops for
> the 1980 International AA Convention.
>
>
> It could not have happened with the connivance and approval of General
> Service Office.Briefly, that is the story of the betrayal of Alcoholics
> Anonymous by those trusted servants sworn to have no opinon on outside
> issues.And we can be pretty sure they didnt get the idea from their
> study of the Good Book.
>
> Ted W
> Ted W. is a long time member of Alcoholics Anonymous (28 Years). He is
> a believer in Jesus Christ and writes on recovery related issues at
> Http://Christianrecovery.blogspot.com
>

[Robert McGregor]

http://www.heise.nu/AALawsuit/
http://tinyurl.com/abk9q

"Jean Staffen" <estaffen@austin.rr.com> wrote in message
news:d7Eye.89074$j51.65638@tornado.texas.rr.com
> Strongly suggest you reread the third tradition, Doug. The only
> requirement for membership is still the desire to stop drinking.
>
>
> dougwa wrote:
>> Early AA was a good thing. As Dr.Bob (one of the co-founders of
>> AA) said in his last major address to AA's:
>>
>> "It wasnt until 1938 that the teachings and efforts and studies
>> that had been going on were crystallized in the form of the 12
>> steps.....We already had the basic ideas....We got them, as I
>> said , as a result of our study of the Good Book"
>>
>> How then did AA, a program with Christian Roots, evolve into a
>> program that has Gay AA meeting and Gay AA Roundups (
>> www.gayalcoholics.com). Indeed, the new (and improved?) 4th
>> Edition of Alcoholics Anonymous has further deleted some of the
>> Christian Testimonies of early AA pioneers (Clarence Snyder of
>> Cleveland Ohio: Home Brewmeister) and replaced it with stories of
>> unrepentant homosexuals: "Tightrope" ** The question is "How did
>> it happen" .
>>
>> The website of " International Advisory Council of Homosexual Men
>> & Women in AA) " gives us part of the answer to the sordid story.
>> And it involves betrayal at the highest levels of Alcholics
>> Anonymous. Alcoholics Anonymous has a tradition (Traditon 10)
>> which states:
>>
>> "Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence,the
>> AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy"
>>
>> And the traditon served AA well for the first 40 years of its
>> existence. There were no officially designated "Gay" meetings
>> during that time. However, as society itself began to deteriorate
>> and begin to be more accepting of perversion, AA began to reflect
>> this change. Homosexual activists began clamoring for official
>> acceptance within AA. But they had to get around the traditon to
>> do it. The General Services Office of Alcoholics Anonymous was
>> all too willing to help. Gay Activists wrote a pamphlet entitled
>> "The Homosexual Alcoholic
>> - A.A.'s Message of Hope to Gay Men and Women." They also
>> published a meeting list: " Meetings for Gay Recovering
>> Alcoholics". Neither of these publications were authorized AA
>> publications. It was sort of an underground AA.
>>
>>
>> Now let me quote from Nancy T., Arlington the homosexual activist
>> largely responsible compiling the gay meeting list:
>>
>> " I made contact with the General Services Office, and sent them
>> copies of the pamphlet and directories. The GSO folks were very
>> kind. Although neither the pamphlet nor the directory were
>> Conference approved, those caring people in New York distributed
>> the pieces of "literature" in response to requests for
>> information from gay/lesbian Alcoholics and their friends and
>> sponsors. They also referred people directly to me. This began a
>> cooperative relationship between the community of gay and lesbian
>> recovering alcoholics and the General Services Office that
>> endures to this day through IAC. " There you are from the mouth of
>> the woman who did it. Alcoholics
>> Anonymous General Serives Office promoting the homosexual agenda.
>> Distributing non-conference approved literature and directories
>> to the public in order to promote an outside issue: the
>> acceptance of homosexuality in society.
>>
>> The General Service Office went further. In 1980 homosexual
>> activists were asked by the GSO staff to help plan two
>> gay/lesbian workshops for the 1980 International AA Convention.
>>
>>
>> It could not have happened with the connivance and approval of
>> General Service Office.Briefly, that is the story of the betrayal
>> of Alcoholics Anonymous by those trusted servants sworn to have
>> no opinon on outside issues.And we can be pretty sure they didnt
>> get the idea from their study of the Good Book.
>>
>> Ted W
>> Ted W. is a long time member of Alcoholics Anonymous (28 Years).
>> He is a believer in Jesus Christ and writes on recovery related
>> issues at Http://Christianrecovery.blogspot.com

[dougwa]

I never said Homosexuals shouldnt be welcome in AA. I said AA should
stop endorsing homosexuality in violation of its traditions. AA gives a
stamp of approval to the homosexual lifestyle, just like some of the
sick Christian Churches do.

[stuart]

dougwa <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1120703945.942041.241670@g49g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> I never said Homosexuals shouldnt be welcome in AA. I said AA should
> stop endorsing homosexuality in violation of its traditions. AA gives a
> stamp of approval to the homosexual lifestyle, just like some of the
> sick Christian Churches do.

Some Christians are better than other Christians. I think that's what you're
trying to say isn't it Ted?

[dougwa]

No. Im saying some "Christians" are not really Christians.

[stuart]

dougwa <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1120782557.831464.198630@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> No. Im saying some "Christians" are not really Christians.

I'm sure God is eternally grateful to have you around to discern that for
him Ted.
Your faith seems strong. It reeks.
You claim to be His spokesman of His morality for others, as if He were some
bush league, exclusive God, available ONLY to those who adhere to narrow,
rigid, narrow moral views
Why don't you show your posts to your pastor, or spiritual advisor, Ted, He
may be able to help you a little, although I don't suppose you have the
humility to think so. Or perhaps, you are so arrogant as to just pre-suppose
all other "real" Christians will tend to agree with you.
I detest "holier that thou" assholes like you.

[dougwa]

I count it an honor to be "detested" by the likes of you. And yes, all
real Christians agree that homosexuality is a sin to repented of.

[stuart]

dougwa <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1120925262.508885.68010@g44g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com...
> I count it an honor to be "detested" by the likes of you. And yes, all
> real Christians agree that homosexuality is a sin to repented of.

I remember my best friend's granny (who was Roman Catholic) went to her
priest and told him she was planning to marry a Protestant. He told her not
to do so, that it was sin, and that she should repent. If not, and she went
ahead and did it, she would go to hell.
She very rightfully told him that not mortal human would determine whether
she was going to hell. She was, of course right Ted.
Your opinion of homosexuality is the same. YOU are a mortal, just like the
mortals who wrote the bible, and who claim to know God's will.
You don't know shit Ted.

[wozza]

"dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1120925262.508885.68010@g44g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com...
>I count it an honor to be "detested" by the likes of you. And yes, all
> real Christians agree that homosexuality is a sin to repented of.

Only someone who hasn't met a homosexual person could say that. Prejudice is
usually the outcome of ignorance and fear. Nobody chooses to be gay. God
makes them that way.

[dougwa]

No Good doesnt make homosexuals that way. Its true they didnt choose to
be that way, but its also true that no sinner has chosen to be a
sinner . Its the sin nature we inherit that causes it. But that doesnt
mean we cant repent and find a new nature.

There are some links to Gay Recovery on my website:

http://Christianrecovery.blogspot.com

[dougwa]

Lets see if I got this right. Marrying a protestant is equivalent to
the vile disgusting behavior of homosexuals? You should get some help
for mental confusion.

[dan mcgown]

"dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1121003294.186875.41810@g14g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com...
> Lets see if I got this right. Marrying a protestant is equivalent to
> the vile disgusting behavior of homosexuals? You should get some help
> for mental confusion.

I'm going to resist the temptation to get into a debate about whether
everyone should be required to be Christian as well as being required to be
straight. Instead, I'm just going to remind you that this forum is about
recovery from addiction to alcohol. Do you have anything to say on that
subject?

[Robert McGregor]

"dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1121003158.643595.154410@o13g2000cwo.googlegr oups.com
> No Good doesnt make homosexuals that way. Its true they didnt
> choose to be that way, but its also true that no sinner has
> chosen to be a sinner . Its the sin nature we inherit that
> causes it. But that doesnt mean we cant repent and find a new
> nature.
>
> There are some links to Gay Recovery on my website:
>


Jeez, Ted. Even I *choose* (but not completely with gay abandon!)
*sin* :) Regardless, I'm heavily into sin, and I'm not alone here!

Must admit though, I borrowed a tape from a friend, who stole the
tape from AA in Australia. After playing the tape, I stole that
paraphrase from Serenity Sam, an AA circuit speaker from Venice
Beach, USA, but that's enough of that, for now. Wouldn't want to glum
up this happy story, would I :) http://tinyurl.com/9y43r

Bob

[stuart]

dougwa <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1121003294.186875.41810@g14g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com...
> Lets see if I got this right. Marrying a protestant is equivalent to
> the vile disgusting behavior of homosexuals? You should get some help
> for mental confusion.

You missed the point, bonehead. We mortals have no right to judge who gets
to go to heaven and who gets to got to hell for whatever reason.
That's exactly what you are doing here in these newsgroups Ted.Maybe you
don't see it, but you are.
Talk to your pastor Ted.

[dougwa]

My Pastor says unrepentant homosexuals are going to hell, but its ok to
marry a Catholic or Protestant.

[Dan McGown]

"dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1121101787.663319.306140@z14g2000cwz.googlegr oups.com...
> My Pastor says unrepentant homosexuals are going to hell, but its ok to
> marry a Catholic or Protestant.

A few questions:
We evidently need some advice from you regarding some other elements of
God's Laws and how to follow them.
1. Leviticus 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female,
provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine
claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify?
Why can't I own Canadians?
2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus
21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her
period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15: 19-24. The problem is how do I
tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.
4. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a
pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is, my neighbors. They
claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?
5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2
clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him
myself, or should I ask the police to do it?
6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an
abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I
don't agree. Can you settle this? Are there 'degrees' of abomination?
7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a
defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my
vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle-room here?
8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around
their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How
should they die?
9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me
unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different
crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two
different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse
and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of
getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we
just burn them to death at a private family affair, like we do with people
who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

[adapted from
http://chuckcurrie.blogs.com/chuck_currie/2004/06/homosexuality_a.html]

[DaveB]

On 11 Jul 2005 10:09:47 -0700, "dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote:

>My Pastor says unrepentant homosexuals are going to hell, but its ok to
>marry a Catholic or Protestant.


Was he sober??

Regards

Daveb

[stuart]

dougwa <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1121101787.663319.306140@z14g2000cwz.googlegr oups.com...
> My Pastor says unrepentant homosexuals are going to hell, but its ok to
> marry a Catholic or Protestant.

Your pastor has no say in who goes to hell and who doesn't Ted.
That's the PART you don't understand, Ted.

That is assuming hell even exists. As far as I am concerned "hell" is
man-made concept used to manipulate the behavior of others since ancient
times.

[Gail]

stuart wrote:
> dougwa <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:1121101787.663319.306140@z14g2000cwz.googlegr oups.com...
>> My Pastor says unrepentant homosexuals are going to hell, but its ok
>> to marry a Catholic or Protestant.
>
> Your pastor has no say in who goes to hell and who doesn't Ted.
> That's the PART you don't understand, Ted.
>
> That is assuming hell even exists. As far as I am concerned "hell" is
> man-made concept used to manipulate the behavior of others since
> ancient times.

Maybe Teds pastor is a repented homosexual and married to Catholic &
Protestant women?LOL!

[wozza]

"dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1121003158.643595.154410@o13g2000cwo.googlegr oups.com...
> No Good doesnt make homosexuals that way. Its true they didnt choose to
> be that way, but its also true that no sinner has chosen to be a
> sinner . Its the sin nature we inherit that causes it. But that doesnt
> mean we cant repent and find a new nature.
>
> There are some links to Gay Recovery on my website:
>
> http://Christianrecovery.blogspot.com

Homosexual people are born that way. If you actually made the effort to get
to know some, you would understand it couldn't be any other way for them.

[dougwa]

http://www.restorationministriesofmobile.org/

It can be another way. Follow the link and find out.

[Hugh Jarse]

"dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in
news:1120782557.831464.198630@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com:

> No. Im saying some "Christians" are not really Christians.
>
>

Replace some with most and you hit it right on the head!!!

Jeff

[Hugh Jarse]

"dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in
news:1120925262.508885.68010@g44g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com:

> I count it an honor to be "detested" by the likes of you. And yes, all
> real Christians agree that homosexuality is a sin to repented of.
>
>

Like they like to say around here, "Some are sicker than others"!

Jeff

[Hugh Jarse]

"dougwa" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in
news:1121101787.663319.306140@z14g2000cwz.googlegr oups.com:

> My Pastor says unrepentant homosexuals are going to hell, but its ok to
> marry a Catholic or Protestant.
>

Well Doug, I guess we can comfortably say that you aren't a Unitarian, are
you?

Jeff

[Al]

dougwa wrote:
> Early AA was a good thing. As Dr.Bob (one of the co-founders of AA)
> said in his last major address to AA's:
>
> "It wasnt until 1938 that the teachings and efforts and studies that
> had been going on were crystallized in the form of the 12 steps.....We
> already had the basic ideas....We got them, as I said , as a result of
> our study of the Good Book"
>
> How then did AA, a program with Christian Roots, evolve into a program
> that has Gay AA meeting and Gay AA Roundups ( www.gayalcoholics.com).
> Indeed, the new (and improved?) 4th Edition of Alcoholics Anonymous has
> further deleted some of the Christian Testimonies of early AA pioneers
> (Clarence Snyder of Cleveland Ohio: Home Brewmeister) and replaced it
> with stories of unrepentant homosexuals: "Tightrope" **
>
> The question is "How did it happen" .
>
> The website of " International Advisory Council of Homosexual Men &
> Women in AA) " gives us part of the answer to the sordid story. And it
> involves betrayal at the highest levels of Alcholics Anonymous.
>
> Alcoholics Anonymous has a tradition (Traditon 10) which states:
>
> "Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence,the AA
> name ought never be drawn into public controversy"
>
> And the traditon served AA well for the first 40 years of its
> existence. There were no officially designated "Gay" meetings during
> that time. However, as society itself began to deteriorate and begin to
> be more accepting of perversion, AA began to reflect this change.
> Homosexual activists began clamoring for official acceptance within AA.
> But they had to get around the traditon to do it. The General Services
> Office of Alcoholics Anonymous was all too willing to help.
>
> Gay Activists wrote a pamphlet entitled "The Homosexual Alcoholic -
> A.A.'s Message of Hope to Gay Men and Women." They also published a
> meeting list: " Meetings for Gay Recovering Alcoholics". Neither of
> these publications were authorized AA publications. It was sort of an
> underground AA.
>
>
> Now let me quote from Nancy T., Arlington the homosexual activist
> largely responsible compiling the gay meeting list:
>
> " I made contact with the General Services Office, and sent them copies
> of the pamphlet and directories. The GSO folks were very kind. Although
> neither the pamphlet nor the directory were Conference approved, those
> caring people in New York distributed the pieces of "literature" in
> response to requests for information from gay/lesbian Alcoholics and
> their friends and sponsors. They also referred people directly to me.
> This began a cooperative relationship between the community of gay and
> lesbian recovering alcoholics and the General Services Office that
> endures to this day through IAC. "
>
>
> There you are from the mouth of the woman who did it. Alcoholics
> Anonymous General Serives Office promoting the homosexual agenda.
> Distributing non-conference approved literature and directories to the
> public in order to promote an outside issue: the acceptance of
> homosexuality in society.
>
> The General Service Office went further. In 1980 homosexual activists
> were asked by the GSO staff to help plan two gay/lesbian workshops for
> the 1980 International AA Convention.
>
>
> It could not have happened with the connivance and approval of General
> Service Office.Briefly, that is the story of the betrayal of Alcoholics
> Anonymous by those trusted servants sworn to have no opinon on outside
> issues.And we can be pretty sure they didnt get the idea from their
> study of the Good Book.
>
> Ted W
> Ted W. is a long time member of Alcoholics Anonymous (28 Years). He is
> a believer in Jesus Christ and writes on recovery related issues at
> Http://Christianrecovery.blogspot.com
>

what an asshole ... whatever happened to tradition 3 then?