"stuart" <ggo@feds.org> wrote in message
news:siCre.49369$wr.17602@clgrps12...
>
> "Darren" <darren@notathome.net> wrote in message
> news:7gzre.9151$q46.6445@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
> >
> > "stuart" <fred@nospam.com> wrote in message
> > news:Glrre.54211$HI.36493@edtnps84...
> >>
> >> Darren <darren@notathome.net> wrote in message
> >> news:coqre.9079$q46.3288@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
> >> > At tonights meeting and on many meetings in the past, members stated
> >> > something on the lines that step 9 isn't about quelling your
concience
> > but
> >> > making the other person feel better. I don't understand. What has
that
> > to
> >> do
> >> > with sobriety? also one member felt bad because he felt good about a
> >> person
> >> > forgiving him... WHAT? If the person who is making amends feels good
as
> >> well
> >> > as the person he/she is making amends too then where's the harm?
surely
> > if
> >> > you're feeling good and because you are feeling good then thats a
good
> >> > thing, yes?
> >> >
> >> > Darren
> >>
> >> I think there are as many interpretations of the purpose of the steps
as
> >> there are members. My take on it is along the lines as yours. What's
the
> >> general idea? To stay sober, right? So, my way if viewing step nine is
to
> >> clean my side of the street so my conscience doesn't bother me.
> >
> > Some members of AA would say that you are being selfish. I would reply.,
> > "reality check boys". The church is down the road there. Go there for
your
> > spiritual and moral guidence. here, the goal is to remain sober but if
> > that's how they do it then fair enough. I could have spoken out last
night
> > but i didn't. Perhaps that was best huh?
> >
> >> But, having said that, AA is also a spiritual way of living which
means,
> > in
> >> part to me anyhow, to be rid of the bondage of self.
> > Impossible. The one person you always wake up with, live with, sleep
with,
> > work with, die with is yourself and the same applies to every creature
in
> > the universe is yourself. There is no such thing as someone or something
> > who
> > is totally selfless throughout thier entire lives. There are varying
> > degress
> > and moments of selflessness but no total selflessnness. Hell according
to
> > the christians not even their god is selfless. The guy needs you to
> > worship
> > him. Now thats selfish.
> >
> >>Thus, amending the
> >> wrong done to someone else is viewed in that sense as a very unselfish
> > act.
> >> You have to give it up to receive it.
> > to care what people think about you and to desire to receive forgiveness
> > is
> > selfish
> >>Kindof a funny paradox, but it works.
> > works for what? keeps you sober? Fair enough but it doesn't work for me.
> >
> >> No harm in feeling good about being forgiven IMO, but one can't dwell
on
> >> feeling bad when we are not forgiven either. Fix the problem to the
best
> > of
> >> one's ability then move on.
> > Now I have unofficially done some of step 9. I have two, maybe three
> > people
> > left to apologise to but i am told that alcoholism is a mental ilness
like
> > schitzophrenia or clinical depression hence when we are attacked by our
> > insanity (in or cased we get pissed) then technically we are exhomoured
> > automatically because we are not responsible.so we shouldn't have to
> > apologise but we do anyway. Why? to make them feel better. Sounds not
very
> > sselfish to me.
> >
> > As I say, if i need a christian lesson then i'll go find a church.
> >
> >
> >
> > Darren
>
> Darren, step nine does not suggest we "apologize" It says "make amends",
> which means to repair the damage.
Same difference.
>That may mean the person we have made the
> amend to may not realize you have done so, if you want to look at it that
> way.
Why? How does this help sobriety.
> There's a difference between apologizing and repairing. The classic
example
> is apologizing for stealing from someone. Do you just apologize, or do you
> give them their money back? Big difference
I heard that speech last night. besides the people i hurt were hurt
emotionally. As I have no access to a time machine and Ctrl+z doesn't work
on life then there's no way of undoing the damage i caused and I plead not
guilty through diminished responsibility. .
>
>
Darren