"Darren" <darren@notathome.net> wrote in message
news:7gzre.9151$q46.6445@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
>
> "stuart" <fred@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:Glrre.54211$HI.36493@edtnps84...
>>
>> Darren <darren@notathome.net> wrote in message
>> news:coqre.9079$q46.3288@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
>> > At tonights meeting and on many meetings in the past, members stated
>> > something on the lines that step 9 isn't about quelling your concience
> but
>> > making the other person feel better. I don't understand. What has that
> to
>> do
>> > with sobriety? also one member felt bad because he felt good about a
>> person
>> > forgiving him... WHAT? If the person who is making amends feels good as
>> well
>> > as the person he/she is making amends too then where's the harm? surely
> if
>> > you're feeling good and because you are feeling good then thats a good
>> > thing, yes?
>> >
>> > Darren
>>
>> I think there are as many interpretations of the purpose of the steps as
>> there are members. My take on it is along the lines as yours. What's the
>> general idea? To stay sober, right? So, my way if viewing step nine is to
>> clean my side of the street so my conscience doesn't bother me.
>
> Some members of AA would say that you are being selfish. I would reply.,
> "reality check boys". The church is down the road there. Go there for your
> spiritual and moral guidence. here, the goal is to remain sober but if
> that's how they do it then fair enough. I could have spoken out last night
> but i didn't. Perhaps that was best huh?
>
>> But, having said that, AA is also a spiritual way of living which means,
> in
>> part to me anyhow, to be rid of the bondage of self.
> Impossible. The one person you always wake up with, live with, sleep with,
> work with, die with is yourself and the same applies to every creature in
> the universe is yourself. There is no such thing as someone or something
> who
> is totally selfless throughout thier entire lives. There are varying
> degress
> and moments of selflessness but no total selflessnness. Hell according to
> the christians not even their god is selfless. The guy needs you to
> worship
> him. Now thats selfish.
>
>>Thus, amending the
>> wrong done to someone else is viewed in that sense as a very unselfish
> act.
>> You have to give it up to receive it.
> to care what people think about you and to desire to receive forgiveness
> is
> selfish
>>Kindof a funny paradox, but it works.
> works for what? keeps you sober? Fair enough but it doesn't work for me.
>
>> No harm in feeling good about being forgiven IMO, but one can't dwell on
>> feeling bad when we are not forgiven either. Fix the problem to the best
> of
>> one's ability then move on.
> Now I have unofficially done some of step 9. I have two, maybe three
> people
> left to apologise to but i am told that alcoholism is a mental ilness like
> schitzophrenia or clinical depression hence when we are attacked by our
> insanity (in or cased we get pissed) then technically we are exhomoured
> automatically because we are not responsible.so we shouldn't have to
> apologise but we do anyway. Why? to make them feel better. Sounds not very
> sselfish to me.
>
> As I say, if i need a christian lesson then i'll go find a church.
>
>
>
> Darren

Darren, step nine does not suggest we "apologize" It says "make amends",
which means to repair the damage. That may mean the person we have made the
amend to may not realize you have done so, if you want to look at it that
way.
There's a difference between apologizing and repairing. The classic example
is apologizing for stealing from someone. Do you just apologize, or do you
give them their money back? Big difference.